Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

Villain is a mouse (14/3/1.8). The autorate rules call this TP-A, but it seems more like TP-P to me, so I don't know.

$1/$2 Hold'em. 9-handed.

Hero is button with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Folded to CO who limps. Hero raises. Blinds fold. CO calls.

(5.5 SB)Flop 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

CO bets. Hero raises. CO calls.

I can't remember why I raised here. I think it's because I was on tilt and I can't find a good reason for it, but I want to know if anyone would do this.

(4.25 BB)Turn 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

CO checks. Hero bets. CO calls.

Regardless of whether the flop bet was right, is this Turn bet now correct? The 9's not really a scare card and hasn't improved my hand.

(6.25 BB) River 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

CO checks. Hero checks.

I think the correct line on this hand was to call the flop and fold to a turn bet.

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

Your flop raise looks to be for the free card which you didn't take. The turn card gave you 4 more outs BTW.

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

I've taken to calling the mouse "safe tight." He's the kind of player that thinks AK is a "drawing hand," and doesn't want to put money in the pot until he sees the A or K on the flop. If this is the kind of villian in this hand, I would definitely not be raising the flop or betting the turn.

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

Free card? You have two backdoor draws, to the 2nd flush and the nut straight. Raise the flop to freeze CO on the turn.

Then, hooray, one of your draws improves on the turn, and now you've got a gutshot to the nuts...just what you wanted. Ok, CO checks and you che...huh? Oh, you were on tilt a little, eh?

Raise the flop to freeze your opponent. If re-raised, seriously consider letting it go (right?). If UI on the turn, check or fold, but unless you get TP you're not in a position to bet out (Villan may be using Brad's call the flop raise to C/R the turn play) (right, again?). The river should be pretty clear, if you get there.

It was still a small pot until you bet the turn, and you're fighting too hard against one opponent.

(As always, I have no idea what I'm talking about. Entity and ShillX will educate both of us.)

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Your flop raise looks to be for the free card which you didn't take. The turn card gave you 4 more outs BTW.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, I think so too. Is the free-card raise a reasonable play here? Also, is trying to push him off on the turn reasonable?

I now know where this came from--I read HEFAP last week and the turn bet is a misapplied semi-bluff. Villain's not capable of betting the flop with nothing. My hands for that couple of days contain all kinds of mysterious and depressing bets like this.

Anyway, given that Villain's "tight-safe" (I like that description), it seems that the free-card play will probably work on him (it did here), and so it seems obviously preferable to take the free card, especially since his flop bet means that he's got something. The question is whether this is better than folding. Assuming for the moment that he's got top pair, are my 5.5-ish outs (if he's got a ten, he could have one of my cards, so I'd say I've got more than 3 for the overcards plus 1.5 for the bdfd) enough to justify a call here? And if I can call, is this a good spot for the free card trick?

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

I would raise the flop then gladly take the turn free card. I don't think a turn bet is going to make him fold, and if you bet the river, you're just setting your money on fire. Check the turn.

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Ok, CO checks and you che...huh? Oh, you were on tilt a little, eh?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, but I didn't think so at the time [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] Perhaps that's a component of tilt. Usually tilt makes me weak-tight, but that didn't happen here until the next day. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

For the most part whenever someone bets (especially into a pfr'er) they have something - piece of the board or pocket pair or strong draw. The OES draws out there aren't likely so it's very likely he has at least a pair and you're drawing.

Giving your read of your opponent, going for the free card play look completely fine.

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I would raise the flop then gladly take the turn free card. I don't think a turn bet is going to make him fold, and if you bet the river, you're just setting your money on fire. Check the turn.

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turn bet will NOT make him fold, given that turn card. Agreed on the chip dumping part.

Re: Does My Flop Raise Have a Point?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I would raise the flop then gladly take the turn free card. I don't think a turn bet is going to make him fold, and if you bet the river, you're just setting your money on fire. Check the turn.


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turn bet will NOT make him fold, given that turn card. Agreed on the chip dumping part.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's what I said...