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-   -   Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=407829)

SomethingClever 12-30-2005 04:17 PM

Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
This could be a short one if everyone says fold the flop. SB is your standard TAG. BB is looser and fishier. I didn't have enough of a read to call him an out and out LAG yet, though.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, BB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, Hero...

12-30-2005 04:26 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
Hi Clever-

I like it. If SB is on overs, we'd like to get rid of him now. An average 3/6 player is gonna raise this flop with any 8 or T, I think, and probably wait until the turn to pop the scary stuff like two pair/trips. Basically, I want to 3-bet this flop because any J, Q or K makes me very unhappy on the turn and stops me fromp raising then.

gharp 12-30-2005 04:29 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
I'd three-bet this. I considered just calling, but that actually gives AK/AQ/AJ proper odds to chase their 3-outer. So raise it up!

danzasmack 12-30-2005 04:31 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
[ QUOTE ]
I'd three-bet this. I considered just calling, but that actually gives AK/AQ/AJ proper odds to chase their 3-outer. So raise it up!

[/ QUOTE ]

I also 3 bet. Let's find out where we're at as it is likely you have the best hand.

jba 12-30-2005 04:50 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
I 3bet here, but I'm prepared to fold to further aggression.

oxymoron 12-30-2005 04:57 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
I 3bet since we have position and will re-evaluate on the turn if we should continue. If we were the SB and OOP it's an easier fold facing two cold with the TAG in the hand but with position I prefer a 3bet to define our hand.

SomethingClever 12-30-2005 04:57 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
Haha, well, I guess I screwed the pooch here. The mantra "3bet or fold" drifted through my mind, but I didn't do it for some reason. I didn't really have time to analyze, so I just thought, "call, re-evaluate on turn."

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, BB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, Hero calls, SB calls.

Turn: (7.5 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero... (raises, folds to a 3bet or takes a free showdown?)

oxymoron 12-30-2005 05:38 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
The turn card is the suck. What happened to the BB? If BB calls I don't like raising here because you are not knocking anyone out and are probably beat. I prefer to fold or call. fold &gt; call

However, if you 3bet on the flop and it was checked to you on the turn I prefer to bet out and fold to a raise.

SomethingClever 12-30-2005 05:45 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 

WHOOPS! I totally misposted the turn. Hang on.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, BB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, Hero calls, SB calls.

Turn: (7.5 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero... (raises, folds to a 3bet or takes a free showdown?)

oxymoron 12-30-2005 06:12 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
Okay now I like a raise/fold. SB either doesn't like his hand anymore and will fold or is setting us up for a raise and your read of the BB is that he is a fish/unknown so we might be ahead. Unless the river is an A or T check behind or obviously raise any A or T river.

SomethingClever 12-30-2005 06:52 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
Ok, that was my plan. SB goes "argh... JJ," then folds.

(after the river, he typed "lol" about 50 times, so I believe him).

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, BB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, Hero calls, SB calls.

Turn: (7.5 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB folds, BB calls.

River: (11.5 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
SB checks, Hero checks.

Do I actually have a value bet here?

oxymoron 12-30-2005 07:38 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
[ QUOTE ]
Ok, that was my plan. SB goes "argh... JJ," then folds.

(after the river, he typed "lol" about 50 times, so I believe him).

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, BB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, Hero calls, SB calls.

Turn: (7.5 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB folds, BB calls.

River: (11.5 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
SB checks, Hero checks.

Do I actually have a value bet here?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you do versus this opponent but I curl in a ball and check here unless I have seen this person raise or call down with Q high or something stupid. Or I bet if I see that this person goes to showdown lots and loses and I have enough hands from the player. WtS% &lt; 40 is a bet here IMHO.

Good thing we got SB to fold.

TomBrooks 12-30-2005 07:48 PM

Re: Play along TPTK against 3bettor and unknown/fish
 
FLOP: 3bet

TURN: If you had three bet the flop and SB bet out the turn, I would call and fold to a river bet UI. The way you played it, I call but am not so sure if I should call another bet on the river.


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