500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

Location: Bicycle Casino

The main villain is loose aggressive: His name is George "The Greek Poker God", for those who know him. He will make moves and push people off hands if he detects weakness.

Other factors: I've been running very, very bad. I had been losing about $700 before joining this table, and then I got stacked again on this table. In addition, I've been getting very poor cards and been playing very tight.

Two hours into the game, I finally pick up A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (~$480). I open-raise to $20 (more with more limpers), my standard open-raise even though the table standard is $30 or so. I get called by 3 opponents including George in the SB.

The flop comes 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and the pot contains $80. Everyone checks to me, and I bet $60. All fold to George who calls.

Turn comes 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and the pot now has $200. George now leads into me $150. What's my move?

Garland

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

I think this is a pretty tough decision, but i'd probably be willing to go broke on this hand. I'd probably call turn, and call river (i assume he would push river). You could push turn if you think he picked up a flush draw, but i wouldn't want him to stop bluffing if he has air.

George could have a Q, but he could just as easily have nothing/draw. I guess this is obvious too, but the only real decision is fold or go all-in(whether you push turn or he pushes river). i'd lean towards calling him down, even if I pay off a queen.

i'm not all that confident in this line either, so if someone has a better line, i'd love to hear it.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

You don't say your position relative to the blinds, but I think I would have either limped pf looking to re-pop if I was in early position or raised bigger in middle or late position.

As the hand played out, I don't mind your flop bet, but I think you're beat. It looks like George is holding the Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and was fine calling on the flop with no draws present, but when the straight and flush draw hit on the turn he is going to make you pay to draw.

I don't know if I would be able to get away from my aces in the moment, but that might be the best thing here. You didn't show any weakness for him to be trying to take advantage of, which suggests he has a real hand (I'm thinking KQ or QJ).

If you are going to continue with the hand, you have to push right here while you have some fold equity if he doesn't have a good kicker.

GL

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

[ QUOTE ]
If you are going to continue with the hand, you have to push right here while you have some fold equity if he doesn't have a good kicker.

[/ QUOTE ]

He's not folding a queen. if hero pushes, it has to be because he thinks his hand is best.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

Depending on the villian, a push might fold a crappy suited Q. Thinking about it further, any hand containing a Q in this spot might not fold Q-9, Q-10 and Q-J just picked up a straight draw to go with their trips.

Like I said, I don't know if I could do it, but hero should lay down the aces. Again, if you can't lay them down, push and hope for the best.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

I am a little jaded since I seen the hand and have seen lots of the greek's play.

He could very easily called your raise with KQ, QJ or even Qx as he was tilting from his run ins with Tuckman.

I agree with Vince that this is a push or fold situation and as bad as you were running, I am sure the thought crossed your mind that he indeed does have a Q and there is little chance of him folding it.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Thinking about it further, any hand containing a Q in this spot might not fold Q-9, Q-10 and Q-J just picked up a straight draw to go with their trips.

[/ QUOTE ]

I still think this villain isn't folding a queen, but they didn't pick up a straight draw.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

check the flop there dude.

btw, the action looks very weird. you "open raise" but then have position on 3 others involved in the hand?

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

Garland was UTG or UTG+1 for the hand LA

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Garland was UTG or UTG+1 for the hand LA

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, so then he didn't "open raise" because there had to be a limper?

not trying to be a pain in the ass, but these details are critical in hands like this one.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

Make your standard open $30.

Fold and yell THE ISLAND OF CRETE

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

No he opened for $20 his standard raise.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

I realize that, but in a live game where other people are opening for $30, it's good to do so as well. You can often get away with bigger opens in a live game than online, and since you'll get calls from weak hands, you build the pot with huge equity.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

[ QUOTE ]
I realize that, but in a live game where other people are opening for $30, it's good to do so as well. You can often get away with bigger opens in a live game than online, and since you'll get calls from weak hands, you build the pot with huge equity.

[/ QUOTE ]

I wasn't disagreeing with you Edge, only repling to LA about the opening action. Should have quoted him to be clear.

BTW, I agree that one should be opening for more. I watched all of the web cast of this game, and I would have been opening for $30-$50 most of the time. Shortly after this hand Garland went on a run of good cards and was poping for $30+ for several hands in a row, so I am sure he knows too.

Garland I hope you post the KTs hand and the AQ hand too. Frankly I think those two are much more interesting. Garland I am glad you posted this hand as it was a tough choice to make, but I really think those other two have much more "play" in them, even if they are simpler in the end.

Again good job last night. Even the often critical Bart and Sherly never had a negitive word to say about your play and often commented how well you played.

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

I'm sorry for the missing details. I wrote this very quickly:

First off, the game was 7-handed.

I open-raised to $20 in UTG+1. David Tuckman called on the button as well as George in the SB and a very loose BB. I had position on the blinds, but not on Dave.

I didn't like the idea of checking the flop and giving a free card to a set. And then George will still lead the turn (probably big) and give me the same issue.

Garland

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Garland I hope you post the KTs hand and the AQ hand too.

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought the K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] on a 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] hand was a no-brainer. For those who want to know, I raised UTG+1 to $20 7-handed with the hand above and got called by loose aggressive on button and called by loose passive in BB. Once I bet $50 into a $60 pot and the button guy raised me to $125, I put him on AK or KQ. My hand was huge, and I had about $400 left. My opponent had me covered. I did the natural thing and pushed, and hoped to get KQ to lay down. If not, I had 9 heart outs and 3 T outs, which was 12 outs twice. He actually thought about laying down what was actually AK, but finally called. I didn't improve, but I had no regrets how I played it.

I'm not sure if you mean the AQ hand where I "stole" the $125 from AK, but I thought that was pretty standard play. No one was interested on in the hand on the flop, so I just took it away from everyone on the turn.

Garland

Re: 500NL 5/5 Blinds AA hand...
 

Goerge is not known for making moves? I dont remember him for making moves, 90% sure he has a queen.

Results and thoughts...
 

As lapoker17 suggested, I thought about checking the flop. I probably would have done it with 2 opponents, but not 3, even with such an arid board. I especially don't like surrendering the initiative against David Tuckman and George "the Greek Poker God", who are very aggressive. I bet enough on the flop to get information on holdings.

The way it played, I thought it was likely George had a Q and was taking the steps necessary to stack me. The turn was the defining play. Either I was folding, or I was committed to calling down. I don't actually like raising as he will fold all hands I beat and call all Qs. He will probably put me on a big pair after my long deliberation and try to make a move on me on the river.

The truth on "Live At The Bike" archives showed that he actually had 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], so I made a bad laydown here.

Garland