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-   -   Yuck (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=395966)

scotty34 12-11-2005 03:41 AM

Yuck
 
Villain here is generally pretty LAG, and overall a bad player. Gets overaggressive in spots that he shouldn't.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, CO calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, CO calls.

River: (6.50 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero...

What's our plan here?

StellarWind 12-11-2005 03:46 AM

Re: Yuck
 
Bet-call the river.

There is plenty of money to be made off of one-pair hands. Against two-pair you often avoid the raise and don't lose anything compared to checkcalling. Once in a while you make an extra bet off a bluff raise.

Sometimes you lose an extra bet to a straight. Price of doing business; on to the next hand.

imported_leader 12-11-2005 03:49 AM

Re: Yuck
 
[ QUOTE ]
Villain here is generally pretty LAG, and overall a bad player. Gets overaggressive in spots that he shouldn't.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is he checking though a worse hand? If not, c/c. Otherwise b/c.

yellowjack 12-11-2005 03:50 AM

Re: Yuck
 
We are definitely not folding, so bet/call or check/call.
I like bet/call. Since I'm assuming we're ahead on the turn, the 9 puts us behind A6, A9, and AJ now. We're still ahead of AQ, A5-A2, not to mention any PP.

LoaferGee12 12-11-2005 03:51 AM

Re: Yuck
 
Yeah bet call looks good. If he bets a big majority of the time when checked to, then I wouldn't mind a check-call. That way you save yourself against the two-pair / straight raise. Otherwise, yeah I'm just bet-calling it.

scotty34 12-11-2005 03:54 AM

Re: Yuck
 
[ QUOTE ]
Bet-call the river.

There is plenty of money to be made off of one-pair hands. Against two-pair you often avoid the raise and don't lose anything compared to checkcalling. Once in a while you make an extra bet off a bluff raise.

Sometimes you lose an extra bet to a straight. Price of doing business; on to the next hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Given his aggressive tendencies, I'm fairly sure he would bet the river with a good portion of the hands that he would call with when checked to. He would also probably bet quite a few hands that he would fold to a bet. Does that change anything?

TTChamp 12-11-2005 04:13 AM

Re: Yuck
 
It seems like the responses have generally been advocating b/c so far. I disagree. To me this is a c/c.

What are you putting villian on that we beat right now? Are we better off betting into him given the holdings we beat? Here is my list of possibilities (remember, he did raise pf):

-KK or QQ are possible, but not probable. Wouldn't he have capped pf? Seems likely that he would have capped given OP description. Even if he tried to get tricky pf, there is a chance he has the discipline to laydown here (more info needed i guess).
-AQ, A2-A5
-Spades: but we probably want to check to him if he has spades. The exception would be if he has something like KTs.
-22-55: He can't be this horrible can he? If so your plan doesn't really matter because you will have all of his money shortly anyway.
-KT or QT.
-Other random crap like KQ: again we would want to check in this case.

I know that OP said he was LAG, but look at the board and think about his range from the CO. Almost everything hit, right down to 67.

So to me the only likely holdings where betting helps us are AQ, A2-A5, KT, QT. These holdings are made even less likely by the fact that there are 2 aces already accounted for.

There are many more hands that beat us, and he often will make us pay two bets to verify we are beat. B/F seems wrong here given OP's description.

Conclusion=c/c

yellowjack 12-11-2005 04:23 AM

Re: Yuck
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Bet-call the river.

There is plenty of money to be made off of one-pair hands. Against two-pair you often avoid the raise and don't lose anything compared to checkcalling. Once in a while you make an extra bet off a bluff raise.

Sometimes you lose an extra bet to a straight. Price of doing business; on to the next hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Given his aggressive tendencies, I'm fairly sure he would bet the river with a good portion of the hands that he would call with when checked to. He would also probably bet quite a few hands that he would fold to a bet. Does that change anything?

[/ QUOTE ]

We're betting to extract money from hands that wouldn't bet when checked to, but since he's betting a few we're more inclined to check/call, but you know this..

Peter Harris 12-11-2005 07:14 AM

Re: Yuck
 
[ QUOTE ]
Given his aggressive tendencies, I'm fairly sure he would bet the river with a good portion of the hands that he would call with when checked to. He would also probably bet quite a few hands that he would fold to a bet. Does that change anything?

[/ QUOTE ]

as i told adsman this morning, read the Theory of Poker section pages 209-213 (i think). If player bets more hands than they call with, check-call is best. If player calls more hands than they bet with, bet-call is best.

I like c/c here against an overaggressive, poor player.

POKhER 12-11-2005 07:19 AM

Re: Yuck
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Bet-call the river.

There is plenty of money to be made off of one-pair hands. Against two-pair you often avoid the raise and don't lose anything compared to checkcalling. Once in a while you make an extra bet off a bluff raise.

Sometimes you lose an extra bet to a straight. Price of doing business; on to the next hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Given his aggressive tendencies, I'm fairly sure he would bet the river with a good portion of the hands that he would call with when checked to. He would also probably bet quite a few hands that he would fold to a bet. Does that change anything?

[/ QUOTE ]

C/C - Use your read to make cash.


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