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-   -   Aren't taxes just too high? (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=357519)

Indiana 10-14-2005 11:09 AM

Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
38% income tax, sales tax, not to mention that I just paid $400 to renew registrations at the DMV. Does it really cost this much to keep the machine going?

Indy

tolbiny 10-14-2005 11:40 AM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
No- it costs way more.

RR12 10-14-2005 11:43 AM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
It shouldn't cost this much, we just waste to much money.

adios 10-14-2005 11:49 AM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
I'll give this a political slant. It's fairly obvious to me that Democrats are going to use the budget deficit as a campaign issue and use their tired old class warfare tactics to attack the Bush 2003 tax cuts and advocate higher taxes in 2006 as way to shore up the budget deficit and repeal the "irresponsible' 2003 tax cuts. If taxes are indeed not too high the Democrats will have a winning issue. Some of opined on this forum that the Democrats stance on taxes is not detrimental to their election chances. I couldn't disagree more. The Democrats say they only want to raise taxes on the rich. Apparently the Democrats definition of rich is a household making $200,000 plus a year. That isn't my definition of being rich and I'm going to guess that most people don't see it that way either. And FWIW IMO most people realize that when you go down the path of raising taxes to shore up a budget deficit that it's a slippery slope and that somehow politicians find a way to spend that money on a lot of "pork." There's a simple answer to the budget deficit "problem" which IMO is way overhyped. Sustained economic growth and a reduction in government spending and the biggest ticket spending items are entitlements. Medicare-medicaid spending is growing at an alarming rate (last time I looked twice as fast as economic growth) and Social Security will be running in the red in 10 years or so. With the aging "baby boomers" population segment, entitlement spending will bring about some severe budget deficits if not corrected. It will take a whole lot more than repealing the Bush tax cuts to shore up entitlement spending.

10-14-2005 12:03 PM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
[ QUOTE ]
And FWIW IMO most people realize that when you go down the path of raising taxes to shore up a budget deficit that it's a slippery slope

[/ QUOTE ]

Keynes might disagree. Also, 'IMO' and 'most people realize' don't really make sense together. In your opinion most people realize something? Where does this opinion come from?

And I think the social security issue has been put to rest. I'll leave you with a quote, do with it what you will:

"The official story is that the Baby Boomers are going to impose a greater burden on the system because the number of working people relative to the elderly will decline, which is true.

But what happened to the Baby Boomers when they were zero to 20? Weren’t working people taking care of them? And it was a much poorer society then."

Sounds like a good point to me.

Indiana 10-14-2005 12:07 PM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
nice post man. I'll come right out and say that fiscally I am a republican (socially I'm mixed because I dont like guns and really dont care what gay people wanna do). Take the Bureau of motor vehicles. I went in there the other day and watched the lady at the cash register just churning out the cash. Seriously, after paying $400 before leaving to register a car, a boat, and boat trailer I really felt like selling everything I owed and just quit working. Really, what could they possibly be doing with that much $? These are the laziest employees I've ever seen by the way. I gotta believe that we can cut spending and put more $ in the pockets of the american people. And please stop using the excuse that the Europeans pay more tax and we are lucky. We are not the EU, we never will be, and its not a fair comparison. In the EU the gov. wipes the citizens asses and that is very unamerican.

Indy

bobman0330 10-14-2005 12:50 PM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
Is that 38% state + federal?

Anyways, I think the problem isn't so much that the tax rates are too high, but that there are too many stupid deductions. For example, the mortage interest deduction, in addition to costing the Treasury a ton of revenue, also lead to an economically disastrous misallocation of funds. I'm not extremely well versed in the tax law, but I bet there are also some deductions that should be erased for the top bracket, because they make less sense when applied to the rich.

adios 10-14-2005 01:04 PM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
[ QUOTE ]
Keynes might disagree.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why because Keynes would look askance at cutting government spending during a period of economic growth?

[ QUOTE ]
Also, 'IMO' and 'most people realize' don't really make sense together. In your opinion most people realize something? Where does this opinion come from?

[/ QUOTE ]

Same place where your opinions come from.

[ QUOTE ]
And I think the social security issue has been put to rest.

[/ QUOTE ]

How so?

[ QUOTE ]
"The official story is that the Baby Boomers are going to impose a greater burden on the system because the number of working people relative to the elderly will decline, which is true.

But what happened to the Baby Boomers when they were zero to 20? Weren’t working people taking care of them? And it was a much poorer society then."

Sounds like a good point to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

In 1950 16 workers supported one Social Security recipient. Today it takes 3 workers to support each recipient. By 2030 it will be 2 workers to support each recipient given that there are no changes made to the system. The ratio of retirees to new workers coming into the system will rise due to the size of the "baby boomers" population segment reaching retirment age. It's projected that Social Security will be running a deficit in ten years. What's been settled? I won't be able to get back to this thread until later but I'd really like to know what you think has been settled and how it has been settled.

adios 10-14-2005 01:10 PM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
So everyone in the top bracket is rich? Also what is income really? We've been over this many times on the forum but the problem with an income tax is that the income earner base is very diverse and thus defining income for all income earners is an impossible task and IMO is the breeding ground for special interest groups. If income is just money earned on a W-2 then isn't the standard deduction costing the government tons of money as well? Why have the standard deduction?

Matty 10-14-2005 02:00 PM

Re: Aren\'t taxes just too high?
 
[ QUOTE ]
I'll come right out and say that fiscally I am a republican

[/ QUOTE ]Are you sure about that?

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/blo...y_Spending.jpg

http://www.allhatnocattle.net/bush_deficit_graphic.gif


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