Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

1/2 NL game - New player comes in announces he always does business whether he was favorite or not. Sure enough - two to three hours in - He did business like 3 times where I think he was favorite everytime.
So I get into a hand where he goes all in when he flopped top 2 pairs and I called with bottom set. Pot was about $900. I turned down his offer for business and I go ahead and win the hand. He starts mumbling to the table about how young kids these days dont appreciate and return favors. Dont get me wrong - he wasnt being a jerk -- it was just a little comment and he didnt seem like a jerk at all so I know was a just a little upset about losing.
I normally dont do business when Im a favorite - I do sometimes when it's a coin toss or if Im a dog BUT I never bring up business - I dont mind just playing it out but in the cases when Im a dog - I always accept someones offer to do business but I never ask - How can anyone turn down doing business when you are a dog anyways?? heh heh.
But in this situation - would you go out of your own playing standards and do business out of courtesy?? To be honest also -- I would have accepted his offer to do business if I was the dog. I play for a living so winning and losing means more than someone playing for pleasure or for supplemental income.

For those that are not sure what doing business means....
"doing Business" in a club means the two player agrees to run the Turn and River card more than once - usually 2-3 times then u chop up the pot according to how many times u win.

What do you guys think?

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

[ QUOTE ]
1/2 NL game - New player comes in announces he always does business whether he was favorite or not. Sure enough - two to three hours in - He did business like 3 times where I think he was favorite everytime.
So I get into a hand where he goes all in when he flopped top 2 pairs and I called with bottom set. Pot was about $900. I turned down his offer for business and I go ahead and win the hand. He starts mumbling to the table about how young kids these days dont appreciate and return favors. Dont get me wrong - he wasnt being a jerk -- it was just a little comment and he didnt seem like a jerk at all so I know was a just a little upset about losing.
I normally dont do business when Im a favorite - I do sometimes when it's a coin toss or if Im a dog BUT I never bring up business - I dont mind just playing it out but in the cases when Im a dog - I always accept someones offer to do business but I never ask - How can anyone turn down doing business when you are a dog anyways?? heh heh.
But in this situation - would you go out of your own playing standards and do business out of courtesy?? To be honest also -- I would have accepted his offer to do business if I was the dog. I play for a living so winning and losing means more than someone playing for pleasure or for supplemental income.

For those that are not sure what doing business means....
"doing Business" in a club means the two player agrees to run the Turn and River card more than once - usually 2-3 times then u chop up the pot according to how many times u win.

What do you guys think?

[/ QUOTE ]

I definitely would not have done business in this situation, he had 4 outs, you are at a huge disadvantage here. Some people expect because they always do something whether it's to their advantage or not that everyone will do exactly the same with them. You did nothing wrong, don't worry about his reaction.

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

(I'm going to completely ignore ethics and discuss what's best for you monetarily.)

It doesn't make a difference in your EV on the specific hand, do you should consider other things.

There are basically two significant factors here:

1) Stack size- Did you have a big stack going into this hand? If you chopped it, would you still have a big stack most of the time? Is this a table where you want a big stack? If you've got your original buy-in and there are some deep donks at the table, definitely don't chop. If there are deep donks at the table and you both were deep going into this hand, chop. If you want a short stack, do the opposite.

2) Metagame- Would it be +EV to piss this guy off?

Ethically, it would've nice of you to fold the set [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

Hi PokerCrab,

I think you're confused. Being a dog in a hand should not make you more (or less) likely to do business. Running the hand a few times just makes the results move more quickly toward their expected result. So, your expectation is the same, regardless of whether you run it once for the whole pot, or 3 times for a third of the pot each time. All it does is reduce your and your opponent's variance. Consequently, it's bankroll considerations, and not whether you're leading or trailing in a hand, that matter when it comes to deciding on whether to do business.

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

doing business has nothing to do with being a dog or not, it has everything to do with your EV in a given hand and reducing your variance if you cant stomach losing huge sums of money.

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

I'll be the first to ask...

WTF does it mean to do business?

Edit: Maybe I should read the post entirely first before posting.

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

As cero pointed out, running it any amount of times will not change the EV of the hand at all. It just reduces variance.

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

he's new, so no
3 months from now, sure

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

[ QUOTE ]
he's new, so no
3 months from now, sure

[/ QUOTE ]

making a variance-related decision based on your closeness with the guy....i like it

Re: Club Ettiquettes - would u do business in this situation?
 

nice presumption
if it's an established part of playing with him and he's a regular
else i'm not going to waste table time
period