Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

No reads - I'm new to the table and have never played with any of these guys before. That's what I get for not playing poker for two weeks. For some reason I felt like a deer trapped in the headlights on this hand. It was something about his bet sizes or something. What do you guys think?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

CO ($134)
TWP ($394)
SB ($235.10)
BB ($369)
UTG ($340.34)
MP ($124.12)

Preflop: TWP is Button with 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $2.
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, CO calls $4, <font color="#CC3333">TWP raises to $15</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls $11, CO folds.

Flop: ($36) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets $14</font>, TWP calls $14.

Turn: ($64) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets $50</font>, TWP calls $50.

River: ($164) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets $65</font>, TWP calls $65.

Final Pot: $294

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

well hello calling station

I probably raise that flop and then get out if the turn doesn't help me

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

I think I throw in a raise on the flop to try and take this down and if he bets into me again on the turn (w/o improving) I probably fold.

Definitely a weird hand, one that I also have trouble with and what makes playing suited one gappers and suited connecters difficult to play when you raise and hit TP instead of a sweet draw.

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

Does anyone have any experience with these bet sizes in this situation? What do you think they mean? He bets tiny on the flop, reasonable on the turn, and then small again on the river? Weird. And I viewed a flop raise as a bluff essentially, so I wasn't too happy about it, but I didn't want to fold, but I don't really like my call...I suck at poker.

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

unfortunately, I have had experiences where that exact pattern is a sign of strength, and I have had experiences where that exact pattern is a sign of weakness...its really hard to tell just from the text

I think calling down the whole way is way too much spewing...I'd prefer to raise, figure out where I'm at, and cut my losses right there, or take it down. If I end up hitting my flush, then I make a nice pot.

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

These bet sizes often mean that, on the flop you didn't raise so you must have high cards that haven't paired yet peeling one off. On the low turn, he bets bigger to make you fold said big cards but you don't do it. On the river, he wants to showdown cheapish because he has no freaking idea what you have but has something with showdown value himself. You are rarely ahead on the end but every once in a while they'll show you a small pocket pair.

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
I suck at poker.

[/ QUOTE ]

You ain't the only one!
[ QUOTE ]

Does anyone have any experience with these bet sizes in this situation? What do you think they mean? He bets tiny on the flop, reasonable on the turn, and then small again on the river? Weird. And I viewed a flop raise as a bluff essentially, so I wasn't too happy about it, but I didn't want to fold, but I don't really like my call...

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree the bet sizes are weird. I would think that the flop bet is a bluff or a draw given the size, which makes me inclined to raise.

The turn and river are kind of weird. The turn almost looks like a bet where he hit his hand, but then he makes a small river bet, possibly for value?

I dunno, its weird but I think I raise the flop and see what happens.

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
These bet sizes often mean that, on the flop you didn't raise so you must have high cards that haven't paired yet peeling one off. On the low turn, he bets bigger to make you fold said big cards but you don't do it. On the river, he wants to showdown cheapish because he has no freaking idea what you have but has something with showdown value himself. You are rarely ahead on the end but every once in a while they'll show you a small pocket pair.

[/ QUOTE ]

I feel like this sittuation is either a mild hand looking for a showdown, like you describe, or something like 89s or 88's that put out a feeler on the flop and is then looking for value on turn and river.

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

i raise the flop here. and the way its played i find somewhere to fold unless i think he is weak and I am considering a bluff, or i have a read that he is way aggro. but when 4/5 players bets the turn like that they are ahead more than 4/5 times. he is betting out twice OOP against a pfr.

i hate these spots too, they are 100% pain if you dont have a read. and usually are if you do anyway. i like to bet the flop or raise a small bet like this and check behind on the turn, most passive TAG players will check to you on the river or vbet if they are ahead. if they are extra aggressive I might call a bluffy bet.

either way if a person wants to bluff off a pair of nines here while OOP its all they can eat.

Re: Totally lost TPWK - weird hand
 

I read him as

Flop: "I bet my draws small and my made hands big. I'm on a draw, and since the flop is rainbow, I'm on an OESD."

Turn: "I made my straight, betting bigger now."

River: "I'm surprised you're still here, but since you are I'll just value bet this puppy."