Frozen Embryo
 

If Christians believe life begins at the exact moment of conception.

Then is the soul and conscience in a form of suspended animation in a frozen embryo until a time when it is used or discarded?

Big Steve [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

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If Christians believe life begins at the exact moment of conception.

Then is the soul and conscience in a form of suspended animation in a frozen embryo until a time when it is used or discarded?

Big Steve [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

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It appears that there is some disagreement among people who identify themselves as christians on this subject.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...art=13&vc=1

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

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If Christians believe life begins at the exact moment of conception.

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Actually, it's just something they say, it's not something they believe, a fairly usual situation in a lot of religion. You can test them by showing slides at 0.1 second intervals of a sperm approaching an egg, entering, etc. Ask them to stop on the slide where conception occurs and tell you a)why that slide and not the slide before or after b) how do they know that?

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

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You can test them by showing slides at 0.1 second intervals of a sperm approaching an egg, entering, etc. Ask them to stop on the slide where conception occurs and tell you a)why that slide and not the slide before or after b) how do they know that?

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That'd be interesting. Can you link to any such experiments you know of (or their descriptions)?

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

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[ QUOTE ]
If Christians believe life begins at the exact moment of conception.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, it's just something they say, it's not something they believe, a fairly usual situation in a lot of religion. You can test them by showing slides at 0.1 second intervals of a sperm approaching an egg, entering, etc. Ask them to stop on the slide where conception occurs and tell you a)why that slide and not the slide before or after b) how do they know that?

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I say it and I believe it. I'm not sure what relevance there is to which slide it is on? I'm pretty sure it happens before someone chooses to terminate it.

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

This brings up a weird question: what is existence like for an immediately post-conception zygote? The lack of brain would prohibit it from thinking or feeling emotions...what senblance of humanity could it experience?

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

Not a xtian, but the soul is something that is earned. It is created both from eternal sources as well as from internal sources of freewill. So embryo's have a blank "soul" T.R.

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

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If Christians believe life begins at the exact moment of conception.

Then is the soul and conscience in a form of suspended animation in a frozen embryo until a time when it is used or discarded?

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It is not a "Christian belief" that life begins at the moment of conception any more than it is a Christian belief that the sun rises in the east. Anyone who thinks that there is not a genetically unique human life present after conception is uninformed. It is just as alive as any single-celled organism. There are some rather complex concerns over twinning to be sorted out--but my point is that it is not for Christian belief but for science and natural reason to inform us when human life has begun.

Furthermore, it is not merely by reason of Christian belief that I think that the soul is made present at conception.

Now, to answer your question... yes, the intellectual soul is present at conception and hence certainly also at the point when an embryo, after being conceived in vitro, is typically frozen. (This is also after the period in which twinning is possible is over, so that debate can be set aside). What it is to have an intellectual soul is principally to have the capacity for intellectual activity. The development of such a capacity depends upon the development of the body. Whether there is any awareness of any kind by the soul of a frozen embryo is a question that is practically impossible to answer. However, the soul would remain present as long as the embryo remains alive (which it is while it is frozen).

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

I find it interesting that people place such significance on a new life starting because something has been created that is genetically unique?

So what? To be concerned about that just seems anal to me. So what something unique was destroyed when something else unique can be created in no time?

Ok, so BTirish says it is a fact that life is created at the moment of conception. We can't argue with that because his definition of life is the same as his justification of when life begins.

So it would be more useful to coin a term that describes "meaningful life" in discussions like this.

Having said that, I dont think the OP's intention was to ask a question about facts, it was to ask what Christians believe, not what is a rational opinion on the subject, so I will leave you to it.

Re: Frozen Embryo
 

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Ok, so BTirish says it is a fact that life is created at the moment of conception. We can't argue with that because his definition of life is the same as his justification of when life begins.

So it would be more useful to coin a term that describes "meaningful life" in discussions like this.

Having said that, I dont think the OP's intention was to ask a question about facts, it was to ask what Christians believe, not what is a rational opinion on the subject, so I will leave you to it.

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First, I was merely engaging in conceptual clarification. The OP posed his question in a misleading way by stating that it is a Christian belief that life begins at conception. I was merely pointing out that the fact that life begins at conception has nothing to do with Christian belief. So, if being clear in the terms of discussion is "anal"--well, ok.

Second, I'm certainly open to a discussion of what is or isn't a meaningful or morally significant life. As you point out, this wasn't the subject of the OP's question. And, in my post, I did make effort to answer the OP's question, after clarifying the subject.

Third, I would challenge the contrast you draw between a rational opinion and a Christian belief.