Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

Opponent in this hand is overly lag-tricky. He seems to understand nl concepts but everyhand is afflicted with a strong case of FPS. He is playing lots of hands and is coming in for min raises, medium raises, large raises, cold calling with any 2 etc. After 100ish hands he's ~64/35/2.

Also, throughout the day, I had made a couple "heroic" river calls that ended poorly when my read was off. As this hand played out I called pretty quickly because his "line" just did not make logical sense to me. As soon as I did, and before seeing the results, the previous two calls flashed through my head and I let out an audible groan.

Also, I'll probably get flak for playing the hand as I did (as my posts normally do). Villian was not a complete idiot; he would shut down to aggression. However, for whatever reason, he was perfectly happy with hanging himself when he was the aggressor. I should also note that in a previous hand against me he had trip Q's with a 6 kicker and made a very obvious 1/3-1/2 pot blocking bet. I raised the bet with a missed draw and he had called and won.

Anywho, the hand:
Party Poker (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Villian limps, Funk raises to $8 <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, Villian calls.

Flop:($18) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Villian bets $10, Funk calls.

Turn:($37) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Villian bets $10, Funk calls.

River:($56) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Villian bets $70, Funk calls?

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

Blinds, guess its 1/2?

Stack sizes?

His line looks very suspicious and can certainly be a bluff but I fold anyway. The risk/reward ratio for him with that "bluff" is not very good and he might think you sees him as you do and therefore make this bet with an 8 hoping you have the ten.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

Sorry, I was having convertor probs. Party $200 6max, effective stacks $200.

Edit to add: Hatt, I think the risk v. reward ratio is what I'm wondering about. These situations come up occasionally- sometimes I'll be right, sometimes I'll be wrong.
I guess am wondering how many other players are pulling the trigger attempting to make "heroic" calls and whether or not these calls are +ev, regardless of how strong a read may be (this of course changes if you have a long relationship with the villian and your read comes from hours of play together).

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

Why didnt you raise the flop?
Played as is. Fold.

-JP

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

This hand is retarded. Who cares about making heroic calls?

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

allin

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

I doubt you win this enough to make it worth it. I often see villians take this line w/ middle pair and gain the courage for a big bet when they river trips or two pair and are more confident of their hand.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

JMP- "Also, I'll probably get flak for playing the hand as I did (as my posts normally do). Villian was not a complete idiot; he would shut down to aggression. However, for whatever reason, he was perfectly happy with hanging himself when he was the aggressor."

Maybe raising is better, but at the time, with his range being so wide I wanted him to a) continue betting with a worse draw and not shut him out from making a 2nd best hand and b) not have the chance the blow me off my hand w/ a reraise. I thought his flop bet could have been a wide range of hands. His turn bet seemed to narrow it down (in my mind) to either a draw or a draw + very weakish hand. That was my reasoning for not raising the flop. I think there is probably merit in raising the turn (expecting a fold) although the river could potentially be difficult to play.

Aces- If I think there is a chance that it could raise my longterm wr, I do.

Billy- I would agree with your assesment if Villian was a normal bad player. However this was Captain FPS (while playing I mused that perhaps he was a bigger player who was trying to get better at LAG style and playing below his stakes. He understood his NL concepts, he just thought that he was playing in the big game every hand). I had shown little interest in the hand (aside from some sort of draw or uber-strong hand that was not afraid of either of the FDs on the turn). I didn't see him expecting to be paid off by an overbet... Also, erin ness is perfect, red "X", or not.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

Can villain have something like AJ/AQ, given preflop action?
If these hands are quite possible, I'd lean more toward folding. Nothing sucks worse than picking off a bluff and losing anyways.
I'm just not sure this is the guy you want to make these "big calls" against--sometimes I make a call like this, but it will generally be against someone where I have a decent idea of their hand range, or where a weird line they take really sticks out. But against "Captain FPS", who seems to be taking strange lines all the time, no? and you have no hand range for him listed, I would fold.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

Niet,
He was raising over 30% of his hands. I think I can comfortably take pocket pairs and aces out of his hand range.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Villian was not a complete idiot; he would shut down to aggression. However, for whatever reason, he was perfectly happy with hanging himself when he was the aggressor.

[/ QUOTE ]

These seem like pretty good reasons to raise the flop/turn, IMO.

You are not trapping, here.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

[ QUOTE ]
He was raising over 30% of his hands. I think I can comfortably take pocket pairs and aces out of his hand range.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough.

Do you have any idea what he does have here though? I would still feel uncomfortable calling a bet here from a guy who likes to take lots of weird lines if he might very well play any hand like this.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

Big,
I am pretty torn on both of those options.

I didn't like raising the flop because I did not want to face a big reraise or turn donk-bet that could blow me off my draw. On the turn I thought his bet screamed "I have a draw." If he does have a draw I think he is calling any reasonable bet. If he has a draw plus a weakish pair I feel like I screw myself by creating a decent sized pot when I miss and I don't have the heart to fire a third barrell.

I'm just not sure against this opponent but your thoughts are greatly appreciated.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

I think calling here is pretty bad. I think calling the flop isn't' bad, but his bet on the turn makes it look like he just wants to see another card. Raise there, he'll fold a ton of hands, and check the river to you giving you a chance to take it there or value bet a made flush. You're not even ahead of some of his no pair hands he could be betting.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

UO,
I am 100% certain he would raise with AJ-AK. The hands I think I should be most worried about contain a 3 or a 4 plus a FD. If he held a T in his hand I don't think he makes that size bet on the turn (unless it was a super weak T like T2, then maybe).

Furthermore I think he would put me on a range of hands. If you are in his situation doesn't it seem like a horrible time to value-overbet? The board was the definition of draw-heavy; if I held a hand that could fade an overbet, wouldn't he have heard from me on the flop or turn?

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

I make the turn $40 and half potting the river if checked to. Most of the time he will fold.

Re: Calling an over-bet with A-high?
 

Way,
I've been thinking somewhere along this line would have been best.