\"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

UTG has dropped like 3 buyins doing completely retarded crap. Witness the UTG post, for example...

I had been running super hot and the blinds had been getting out of my way. I am aware that isolating w/22 is not standard. I am also aware that betting the turn is not standard, but against this doof who very well may have called the flop with literally any 2, I thought my turn bet was very likely for value, and planned to fold to a raise and take a free showdown. This situation was very unique to this one player.

This may seem like low content, but it isn't, imo. I've had people criticize me for betting boards like this before... this is an exmple of why I do it. After all, you can't win by checking.


Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (4 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. UTG posts a blind of $30.
UTG (poster) checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (7 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds, UTG calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls.

River: (6.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG folds.

Final Pot: 7.50 BB

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

at 20/40 i dont see why you wouldnt try, at a lower limit i wouldnt do it unless the rake is capped because it works only rarely and it usually isnt worth losing the extra 50 cents or whatever, here you have nothing to lose so it has to be +EV

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

If he's retarded enough to fold in a spot where he's chopping 100% of the time, then obviously the bet is good. And while I'm not real familiar with the 20/40 rake scheme, I'd imagine that the rake is already maxed before the river bet, so there's no point in not betting.

I just can't imagine what causes anybody to fold to your bet.

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

How many times have you bet this and won? This is your profit.

How much extra rake did you pay for it? How much extra time did you spend waiting for him to call instead of dealing the next hand? What is the opportunity cost of spending time playing this hand instead of moving on? This is your cost.

Most people think the cost &gt; profit. Your post proves it's not clear cut, but I'm still checking behind in the same spot without some real evidence that my opponent is an idiot (which you may have here).

Good luck.
Eric

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

Seems like your opponent may have just been not paying 100% attention and thought "if i don't improve on the river, i'm folding" so good bet.
I think it's always good ot bet in chop situations, and even in those where chopping is likely, but not always 100% (like when you get a board like 34567 after much action and bet this knowing your opponent most-likely does not have an 8). I bet in all these situations.
I figure you're playing the game, not the rake. So take advanatge of every +EV bet you can.

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

OMG.

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

i was villain in this hand [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

[ QUOTE ]
I figure you're playing the game, not the rake. So take advanatge of every +EV bet you can.

[/ QUOTE ]

You may ignore the rake, but you'll still have to pay it.

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

[ QUOTE ]
How many times have you bet this and won? This is your profit.

How much extra rake did you pay for it? How much extra time did you spend waiting for him to call instead of dealing the next hand? What is the opportunity cost of spending time playing this hand instead of moving on? This is your cost.

Most people think the cost &gt; profit. Your post proves it's not clear cut, but I'm still checking behind in the same spot without some real evidence that my opponent is an idiot (which you may have here).

[/ QUOTE ]

I only do this if the rake is capped already, which at 20/40, it is at this point.

The only real issue is the oportunity cost of the next hand. Considering it will only take a few seconds for him to call or fold, I think this is +EV.

Re: \"Bluffing\" when the nuts are on board (lc, but some value)
 

[ QUOTE ]
i was villain in this hand [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Please tell me you're kidding.