My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

2/4 6 max game. I have 400, villain stack 300.

I raise to 14 in CO with TJ. Both blinds call.

Flop Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]($43)

SB checks, BB bets 30, I call.

BB donkbets me alot, I fold most of the time.

Turn 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($105)

He bets $60, I push.

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

don't like it

he could easily have a strong Q and call IMO

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

With your read that he donkbets you a lot... Do you mean he minbets or makes bigger bets like this often?

If it's the former I might fold here. But if it's the latter, I might call down. This way I may make more money by inducing another bluff on the river while I'm ahead, or maybe get him to call a value bet. If he folds I don't make anymore. If he calls and I'm beat, I lose everything. He probably isn't calling unless he has you beat.

Hopefully this way I make more if I'm ahead and lose less when behind. Those are just my instinctual thoughts though, I could be wrong.

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

Hey, something thats important.
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BB donkbets me alot, I fold most of the time.


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OK, fair enough, hie bet means less.

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I raise to 14 in CO with TJ. Both blinds call.

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It's a 3way pot. It's semiprotected. This should add a little more credence to his "donkbet."

On the turn he folds worse hands, KT, AT, QJ maybe, Q9(worse) maybe. But if he was donkbetting bottom pair, he got there; donkbetting top pair, he has top two, or a hand which he wont fold. So really you're folding out a bluff... Or the rare KJ/J9/AJ type ~8or fewer outs hands.

I probably fold this flop, my pride definately makes me make this call (or raise) now and then, but if I called flop, calling the turn is better then pushing.

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

Hey Bobbo, what do you mean by the pot being "semiprotected"?

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

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Hey Bobbo, what do you mean by the pot being "semiprotected"?

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Whenever you have a third presence in the hand, (sb inthis hand) who has not shown any weakness or strength (he checked first to act; thats to be expected, checking to the raiser, good hand or bad. He may lead with sets or whatnot, but anyway, his hand value is [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]) the pot is semiprotected. This means that although a bluff is possible (or semibluff, or probe bet, etc etc.) the chance is lessened.

As to the play in this hand, if it was HU, and OP really believed villain donkbet everything, then this isn't a terrible spot to put the clamps on. But, that said, I dont really like the play here, although it could very well have worked. (Or rivered a ten)

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

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It's a 3way pot. It's semiprotected. This should add a little more credence to his "donkbet."

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I really don't think he is paying much attention to this. SB was pretty weak also.

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On the turn he folds worse hands, KT, AT, QJ maybe, Q9(worse) maybe. But if he was donkbetting bottom pair, he got there; donkbetting top pair, he has top two, or a hand which he wont fold. So really you're folding out a bluff... Or the rare KJ/J9/AJ type ~8or fewer outs hands.

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My biggest concern is that he doesn't fold out the AT, KT, QJ hands, and I'm just spewing here. But his stack size is somewhat awkward, push is about all I can do. I think 88, 99, KJ, AJ are actually most likely hands for him. I definitely think he is weak here.

I hate calling turn and feeling completely lost on 50% of river cards, and he will probably half pot it again regardless.


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I probably fold this flop, my pride definately makes me make this call (or raise) now and then, but if I called flop, calling the turn is better then pushing.

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I wonder if this is tilt, I like to open when folded to with any 2 cards worth playing, but when I'm missing every flop, and getting donked I should just really tighten up and stop opening with these type of hands for awhile?

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

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I definitely think he is weak here.

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Why?

Is there a reason you don't think he has a strong Q, or do you just think it is unlikely because his hand range is so wide?

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

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My biggest concern is that he doesn't fold out the AT, KT, QJ hands, and I'm just spewing here

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If he doesn't fold mid pair... EEEEEEEEEEGAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHDDDDDDDDDDD DD. Bad spot.

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I hate calling turn and feeling completely lost on 50% of river cards, and he will probably half pot it again regardless.

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If he will half pot regardless... you will profit more so then pushing. Do you see why?

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I probably fold this flop, my pride definately makes me make this call (or raise) now and then, but if I called flop, calling the turn is better then pushing.


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I wonder if this is tilt, I like to open when folded to with any 2 cards worth playing, but when I'm missing every flop, and getting donked I should just really tighten up and stop opening with these type of hands for awhile?

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It's tilt, but we all have a little bit of it in us. Situations like this happen to me alot, *unfortunately, one byproduct of my style, if you will*, and the trick is thinking logically and not irrationally. Very tough to do.

Re: My hand pretty weak, his weaker?
 

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I definitely think he is weak here.

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Why?

Is there a reason you don't think he has a strong Q, or do you just think it is unlikely because his hand range is so wide?

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His betting indicates a weak probe bet, block bet, or steal to me. KQ is about as strong as I think he can be here. My guess I would be getting re-raised preflop, or cred on the flop if his hand better than AQ.