88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

This hand I limped in EP to take a shot at a cheap flop knowing there was three lagtards at the table. Wishful thinking. When it was 3-bet to me, I felt I have the best hand here way more than 33% of the time so I capped it.

The rest of the hand is unimportant.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 raises</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero caps</font>...

- Jim

Re: 88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

After u've limped, i see the following pros and cons;

Cons: With 8s out of position against idiots, i kind of like seeing a flop without the initiative and seeing the action develop behind you. You also get to see whether Lagtard A caps behind when u just call.

Pros: They'll probably think you're nuts with this move and it will help u get later action. U may get some folding equity when they completely miss the flop and turn as well.

Still i like a simple raise and hope to get re-raised by a lagtard from the beginning better i think.

Re: 88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

do you not normally raise 88 in this position? I don't really see the benifit of the calling because there are LAGtards behind you. I would much rather raise in hopes of getting 'isolated' by one of the lags.

Re: 88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

The LAGtards won't let you have a cheap flop. Limping was bad. Eh, capping is ok I guess depending on how retarded they are. I don't think initiative matters since it'll be tough for us to get it without a set (and against lag tards we need to be seeing lots of showdowns without initiative). Only reason to do is equity and against 4 seperate overcards your equity is uaully just exactly a third. Add to that your hand will be tough to play OOP against these clowns and I'd not build a big pot.

Re: 88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

A raise with a limper is a sign of strength, a 3bet means that he has a real hand. Everyone knows that this applies to decent players, but it also applies to lagtards more often than people give credit for. It isn't common for both of these guys to have week hands.

I would be folding here preflop to the 3 bet. My guess is that you really don't feel comfortable folding here. That is one of the reasons why you should be raising 88 in early position. Raising preflop makes the hand much easier to play.

Re: 88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

To put this in perspective, the 3-bettor did so with 44. I knew when it was raised and 3-bet this was going to be a high-variance hand. That's the way it is with the gamble-it-up lagtards. Not to say what I did was the 100% right thing to do, but I think it has a lot of merit.

Also, open raising would have had little effect imo if these guys wanted to see the flop. They were most likely going to raise no matter how many bets it was to them.

I've also found that lagtards prize pocket pairs very highly. Which has an interesting effect of them playing correctly when they go multiple bets on the turn and some TAG is jamming a big ace at them trying to play king of the mountain.

- Jim

Re: 88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Also, open raising would have had little effect imo if these guys wanted to see the flop. They were most likely going to raise no matter how many bets it was to them.


[/ QUOTE ]

If this is true, isn't a raise first time around correct for the same reasons you decided to cap it in the actual hand?

As for the cap, it's fine, although if I felt I could get any information by just calling (that is, if MP's decision to cap or not cap would define his hand somewhat), then I prefer just calling.

-McGee

Re: 88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

That's true, I was responding to the Hobbs' comment of raising to isolate. I just put it all in one spot.

- Jim

Re: 88 against two bonified lagtards.
 

if you're getting 3-bet preflop by 44 or A6, it's a really good time to raise first-in. limping just invites more crap to enter a pot that's almost certainly ending up shorthanded anyway, so the call is really inconsistent at this table.

given the play, the limp-cap is a v. good idea usually. equity for sure, and youll legitimately scare some less retarded LAGs off overcards on the flop or turn.