unimportant ethics/rules question
 

Scene: 2/4 at Gold Coast, a table mostly of drunk regulars plus a eurotrash jerk who kept hiding his cards, not making verbal declarations, and berated dealers for not figuring out what he was doing.

I'm in seat 4 with the button ambiguously placed somewhere in the vicinity of seats 1/2. I played about 3 hands in two hours up to that point. Cards are dealt and I'm spacing out as usual. I look down to see I have two cards as the dealer finishes dealing, so I see what I have. Q-something... red... suited... whatever. I then look in front of my cards, see the dealer button to my right and the SB/BB nominally in front of me and take my usual casual look down the table to see what's going on over there.

Here's where the confusion starts. By spacing out, I must have faked out everyone at the table, including the dealer, into thinking I was on the BB because I'm usually sharper on the action than most people at this particular table, and if I'm looking down the table for people to act, apparantly they assume I'm right. The action starts to my left, goes around, the BB checks his option (this is when I noticed the whole situation), and we see a flop without me ever putting anything in the pot. It goes check check to me, I check, there's a bet behind and some folds. I pick up my cards donkeystyle such that the players to my sides can see my craptacular Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] that had missed the flop by a long ways, then muck.

Here's the question. Should I have said something as soon as the BB checked and I realized something odd had happened, or do people think it's fine to just let it go "no harm, no foul" since I'm folding 95% on the flop without a thought? I really just wanted to be less of a pain in the butt for the dealer since we'd just had the floor over for one of eurodude's card-hiding escapades. Even if the flop comes A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] I'm probably check-folding the flop in turn anyway.

Re: unimportant ethics/rules question
 

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Cards are dealt and I'm spacing out as usual. I look down to see I have two cards as the dealer finishes dealing, so I see what I have. Q-something... red... suited... whatever.

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By spacing out, I must have faked out everyone at the table, including the dealer, into thinking I was on the BB because I'm usually sharper on the action than most people at this particular table

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Hmmm - are you sure?

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we see a flop without me ever putting anything in the pot

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Unethical, plain and simple.

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Should I have said something as soon as the BB checked and I realized something odd had happened, or do people think it's fine to just let it go "no harm, no foul" since I'm folding 95% on the flop without a thought?

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Say "It's my action" or something at least. To do otherwise is douche-like IMHO.

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Even if the flop comes A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] I'm probably check-folding the flop in turn anyway.

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Please.... [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

Re: unimportant ethics/rules question
 

Yea, you definately need to say something as soon as you realize there is a mistake.

-Yarney

Re: unimportant ethics/rules question
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Cards are dealt and I'm spacing out as usual. I look down to see I have two cards as the dealer finishes dealing, so I see what I have. Q-something... red... suited... whatever.

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
By spacing out, I must have faked out everyone at the table, including the dealer, into thinking I was on the BB because I'm usually sharper on the action than most people at this particular table

[/ QUOTE ]
Hmmm - are you sure?


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There were two players at this table who had to be directed by the dealer to act every single time it was their action, one of whom was my boss's boss we'd run into there. It was pretty bad, especially with the deceptive European. At the table of gigantic idiots, the slightly-less-gigantic idiot is king... probably.



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we see a flop without me ever putting anything in the pot

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Unethical, plain and simple.

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The flop was out before I'd figured out exactly what had happened. I've got better things to do with my life than shoot angles at the Gold Coast's 2/4 tables.


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Should I have said something as soon as the BB checked and I realized something odd had happened, or do people think it's fine to just let it go "no harm, no foul" since I'm folding 95% on the flop without a thought?

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Say "It's my action" or something at least. To do otherwise is douche-like IMHO.

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It was way too late to correct the preflop action by the time I noticed. I'd really like to know what people think I should say after the flop comes and there's two checks to me, confirming I am in fact UTG with Q4s and not BB. The floor had just been over there ten minutes ago and I really didn't want them over again for something that almost all of the time isn't going to matter.




[ QUOTE ]
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Even if the flop comes A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] I'm probably check-folding the flop in turn anyway.

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Please.... [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

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Eh... it's not like I play 2/4 for the money, plus I'd rather be right than win any day. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: unimportant ethics/rules question
 

I think you need to ask yourself what you would have done had the cards been Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

Re: unimportant ethics/rules question
 

Technically you should say something. Realistically, it's 2/4 and there are other factors.

If you didn't notice the error until the flop had already come out, you're not a scumbag angle-shooter if you just let it slide.

If your conscience is really pricking you, just toss the winner the $2 you missed and say, "I spaced out and think I forgot to post."

Re: unimportant ethics/rules question
 

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I think you need to ask yourself what you would have done had the cards been Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

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I would have had the dealer call the floor. That's different because that's a hand I intend to play preflop, and therefore the action needs to be correct since I have every intention of continuing in the hand. With Q4s, obviously I'm folding this 100% of the time UTG anyway, so it's really a waste of time to get the floor over to correct an action that isn't going to matter. Earlier in the night, I had AQo UTG+3. UTG (a known tight player I know well) raises, so I have to think for about ten seconds before deciding whether I want to fold AQ to a single raise or 3-bet. The guy to my left, who has been acting out of turn a lot, folds while I still have cards, which sets off a cascade of folds behind him. I immediately say "Wait, I haven't done anything yet," think, then 3-bet. In that case, I noticed sooner and was able to stop the out-of-turn action before it got too far, and I doubt my 3-bet would have changed any of those folds to calls, so I'm not worried.