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-   -   AK Help (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=407516)

12-30-2005 12:59 AM

AK Help
 
I think TPTK play is the weakest part of my game, and I would like some critisism on this play. No reads on SB.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 5 handed) internettexasholdem.com

Button ($1061.80)
SB ($407.40)
BB ($137.30)
UTG ($96)
Hero ($577)

Preflop: Hero is MP with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $2.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $10</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB (poster) calls $8, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>.

Flop: ($24) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $15</font>, SB calls $15.

Turn: ($54) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $25</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises to $75</font>, Hero calls $50.

River: ($204) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $100</font>, Hero calls $100.

Final Pot: $404

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
SB has 7d Kd (two pair, kings and sevens).
Hero has Ad Kh (one pair, kings).
Outcome: SB wins $404. </font>

I realize how bad SB's play was, but was calling the turn river a poor play?

nrinker 12-30-2005 01:02 AM

Re: AK Help
 
I think you can release on the turn after you are raised. I would bet more on the turn though, you bet 25 into 54, when you get raised there, your left guessing sometimes whether or not your opponent sensed weakness.

Also, Having a read here is what makes TPTK much easier to play. If you see the villain as a tight player, then it becomes very easy to release this type of hand because they likely called you pf to try and hit a set. Or maybe the player is loose, and well, you get the picture....

Gregg777 12-30-2005 01:06 AM

Re: AK Help
 
[ QUOTE ]
No reads on SB.

[/ QUOTE ]

SB is a donk [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

The weak bet on the turn is asking for it. Pot it, then you could release to a re-raise.

12-30-2005 01:07 AM

Re: AK Help
 
[ QUOTE ]
I would bet more on the turn though, you bet 25 into 54

[/ QUOTE ]

FreakDaddy 12-30-2005 04:31 AM

Re: AK Help
 
I bet a little more on the turn here. Let me put it this way, villian pretty much knows what you have here and he wants to get more money in the pot with his trips. I fold this turn raise nearly every time.

xorbie 12-30-2005 06:15 AM

Re: AK Help
 
Check the turn.

Reef 12-30-2005 08:52 AM

Re: AK Help
 
either bet more on the turn or check it

NickPoker 12-30-2005 11:25 AM

Re: AK Help
 
[ QUOTE ]
Check the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

check/call? Maybe, but you are giving up a lot of value to donk calling you down with a weaker king, which happens quite often at this level. I think as a previous poster mentioned it is very read dependent, without a read I would would probably bet 2/3 pot and fold to a reraise. I think hero has defined his hand, and most opponents will not give their opponents the credit for laying down TPTK, so a bluff reraise is unlikely.

emil3000 12-30-2005 11:45 AM

Re: AK Help
 
[ QUOTE ]
Check the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Although I generally feel that this is overused on this forum, in this hand I agree.

cbloom 12-30-2005 01:38 PM

Re: AK Help
 
Why in the world do you check the turn here? Opponent has shown no strength, he can easily be on the str8 draw or a worse pair. The turn card is a total blank. Do you check-call? Checking seems to just telegraph weakness and let you get blown off the hand by a worse hand. If you knew villain was a donk would you still check the turn?

emil3000 12-30-2005 02:17 PM

Re: AK Help
 
[ QUOTE ]
Why in the world do you check the turn here? Opponent has shown no strength, he can easily be on the str8 draw or a worse pair./../ Checking seems to just telegraph weakness and let you get blown off the hand by a worse hand.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, this is true except you don't get blown off cause you call.

Checking behind on the turn with TPTK or an overpair is a very basic NL concept which really should be understood if you want to play at any kind of stakes.

The advantages are basically:
1) You keep the pot small with a mediocre hand.
2)You feign weakness, inducing him to bluff a missed draw in the river. This might well be more +EV than charging the draws on the turn.
3)You feign weakness and get a nice value bet in on the river against a K or maybe Q, which will often be dropped by a tightish opponent.

[ QUOTE ]
If you knew villain was a donk would you still check the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

Depends what sort of donk. I bet this turn against a calling station with very few moves, but against an aggro donk I am likely to check because a checkraise puts me in an ugly -EV spot where I am liable to make a mistake.

Other factors that might cause you to bet the turn is an aggro table image, a more drawy board etcetera, but checking behind with TPTK is very much ABC play.

NickPoker 12-30-2005 02:43 PM

Re: AK Help
 
Very nice post Emil. How would you handle the type of opponent who almost always calls your continuation bet? Do you still check, and hope he will bluff?


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