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-   -   my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river? (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=386462)

Adam22 11-27-2005 11:28 PM

my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
turn CR'er is 23/10.79/1.24

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, Button calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (8.40 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Button calls, BB folds, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (5.70 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Button calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 raises</font>, Hero calls, Button folds.

River: (10.70 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 12.70 BB

W. Deranged 11-27-2005 11:30 PM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
Three-handed I think you should consider checking the turn. And I definitely call the river. The turn check-raise is not always a set or an 8 and you're beating a lot of other stuff. Even 1.24 agg. factor types at the 5/10 level will make some screwy plays. With a read you could fold but heads-up with top pair decent kicker in a 12 bet pot I throw a bet in here.

WillMagic 11-27-2005 11:36 PM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
Yes. Though it's fairly close, 12-1 is just too good.

Will

Carmine 11-28-2005 12:01 AM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
You are betting this turn because....... I ask in this manner so you think about it next time the situation arises.

Yes I call this river. I think you are shown a Q or worse just enough in this size pot for the call to be +ev.

damaniac 11-28-2005 12:01 AM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
As much as I want to call at those odds, he's a TAGish player c/r both players on the turn. Looks like a strong move. But I guess he has like KQ/QJs here often enough.

SackUp 11-28-2005 01:33 AM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
I'd have a hard time not calling this pot HU expecting to see a Qx hand a fair amount of the time.

Consider his range from UTG+1. There are not that many hands that he has which are beating you. I would limit to A8, 44, 88 and maybe K8. I would take out AQ and QQ b/c he should be raising those.

The hands we beat are likely KQo, QJ, Q10, and maybe Q9 and the occasional bluff hand with a PP.

SNOWBALL138 11-28-2005 01:58 AM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
People, even with these stats, checkraise with good hands as well as with monsters, so I'm calling the river. I think his range of hands that beat you is not twelve times larger than QJ hearts, KQ hearts. Also, sometimes villain plays other KQ hands like this.

Jake (The Snake) 11-28-2005 02:53 AM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
I like it all.

I like the turn bet because we are still ahead fairly often and when behind have lots of outs to catch up. If UTG+1 had more aggressive stats, I'd consider checking... but I'd probably still bet because button is behind us.

River is an easy call.

SNOWBALL138 11-28-2005 03:17 AM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
Playing 44 seems plausible for a 23vpip player. Not raising AQ seems too passive. Same with QQ. The only hand that he can have here that beats you that he played properly is 88 for quads.

When I get suspicious, and its hard to tell what specifically villain is representing, other than "strength", I tend to call. The pot being large is just a bonus making my call easier. Expect to be shown KQ or QJ of hearts or sometimes offsuit more than 1/13th on the time.

tetonpete 11-28-2005 03:49 AM

Re: my flush draw rivered me top pair. should i call the river?
 
yes


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