What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

I have a nine year old son who likes to play mostly one to
three table tournaments on Stars. He'll play in $5 or $10
buyins. He's been playing for around six months. I set up
an account for him and I only let him play with my permission. He put $100 of his own money in the account and
although I don't have the exact stats his account now has around $1100 in it. He probably plays about 20 events per week. He plays mostly by himself. Occassionaly when he gets shorthanded or headsup he'll ask me for some help, but
I mostly force him to make his own decisions. He has a very
good intuitive feel for the game. He understands the value
of starting hands. He obviously doesn't know how to calculate pot odds, but knows if the pots big he can play
more hands or try to hit a draw. His main weakness is he sometimes doesn't play aggressively enough, but playing the
5's and 10's this might be a blessing.

Anyway does anyone have any experience with one of their kids playing on the net? This is also beginning to create problems between my wife and me. She thinks playing poker
for money for a nine year old is unhealthy and is afraid that he is going to become addicted to gambling? She's afraid that he will lose interest in activities that nine years old normally participate in, ie, baseball, soccor, riding a bicycle etc. although that has not happened. What
does everyone think?

Bruce

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

Your wife is a wise person by the sounds of it.

And, err, he is 9 ffs!

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Your wife is a wise person by the sounds of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

As well as not being interested in sports, he'll also likely not get interested in:

alcohol
drugs
sex
boys

and a whole list of other things you might be concerned about.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
boys

[/ QUOTE ] ?

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

I don't have kids and am not married, so I'll refrain from saying anything other than asking STT for marital and parenting advice involving gambling is kinda like asking a bartender for advice about drinking.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

i agree with this...

[ QUOTE ]
asking STT for marital and parenting advice involving gambling is kinda like asking a bartender for advice about drinking.


[/ QUOTE ]

To the OP...

you're kid is awesome, he should go pro.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

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Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG's?

[/ QUOTE ]

Get him a 2nd monitor for Christmas and start paying off the mortgage.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

I think you have a responsibility to making sure you keep it under control. You are the parent, and if you see it is getting out of hand or interrupting school work, you need to intervene. I also think that you have to help him develop the discipline and money management that he will need to keep things under control. This, especially at his age, is just as, if not more important than helping him develop poker skills.
Beyond that, I think it's good that he's doing so well at it. It's nice finding something that you and your son can enjoy doing together.

Good luck to the both of you.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

wow, I guess I shouldn't have thought I was the only one. My son is 8 and is doing the same thing, although he is only doing 1 to 3 SNGs a week. He has always watched me play and watches poker on TV with me and a couple of months ago I let him play under my account. He doesn't have as high of an ROI as your son, but he is in the black.

My wife doesn't have a problem with it, but I think as long as your son is still active in other activities that can't be much of an argument and you will find that it gets them more interested in math.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

Tell him that his bankroll has grown enough that he can now play a new game called the "college savings account" in which his money makes itself. After this give him his initial 100 back and keep him playing at a small level as you obviously have no qualms about him gambling in the first place. Perhaps this is where you want to instill some bankroll management skills that could actually become helpful later in life when he realizes you cant retire on pocket aces.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Tell him that his bankroll has grown enough that he can now play a new game called the "college savings account" in which his money makes itself. After this give him his initial 100 back and keep him playing at a small level as you obviously have no qualms about him gambling in the first place. Perhaps this is where you want to instill some bankroll management skills that could actually become helpful later in life when he realizes you cant retire on pocket aces.

[/ QUOTE ]

This would be a dick move, I say let him play as much as he wants until it begins to intervene with other things he needs to be doing.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
This would be a dick move, I say let him play as much as he wants until it begins to intervene with other things he needs to be doing.

[/ QUOTE ]

A dick move? The kid is 9.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[/ QUOTE ]

This would be a dick move, I say let him play as much as he wants until it begins to intervene with other things he needs to be doing.

[/ QUOTE ]

how is this a dick move?? do you remember having 1000 dollars when you were 9.. Imagine the education you could have paid for had you invested a simple 1000 at age 9 into some sort of rolling CD's or into a 10 year trust. But your right, trading a future for a chance to move up to the 20's is the right move.

But im just a donk

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

I think it is ok provided that:

a) You know the password to the account and he doesn't.
b) You sit behind him when he plays and talk to him, trying to teach him about risk/reward, probability. I think a nine year old can grasp these things.
c) You block the chat if possible.

But if you treat it as a babysitter, I think it is a horrible idea.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Tell him that his bankroll has grown enough that he can now play a new game called the "college savings account" in which his money makes itself. After this give him his initial 100 back and keep him playing at a small level as you obviously have no qualms about him gambling in the first place. Perhaps this is where you want to instill some bankroll management skills that could actually become helpful later in life when he realizes you cant retire on pocket aces.

[/ QUOTE ]


I agree with this, a nine year old has no need for 1100 dollars. Take the thousand and put it away for college and keep playing with the orginal hundred. And, if the kid has a major problem with that, you will know that there's a problem developing, so you can put a stop to it.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Your wife is a wise person by the sounds of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

Be careful OP. This type of thing leads to divorce and restricted visiting rights. Believe me, I know.

If bad things go down, Boy is going to ask you someday "Dad, is it true you and Mom split cuz you let me play poker?"

Have him learn chess.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Tell him that his bankroll has grown enough that he can now play a new game called the "college savings account" in which his money makes itself. After this give him his initial 100 back and keep him playing at a small level as you obviously have no qualms about him gambling in the first place. Perhaps this is where you want to instill some bankroll management skills that could actually become helpful later in life when he realizes you cant retire on pocket aces.

[/ QUOTE ]


I agree with this, a nine year old has no need for 1100 dollars. Take the thousand and put it away for college and keep playing with the orginal hundred. And, if the kid has a major problem with that, you will know that there's a problem developing, so you can put a stop to it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know about putting ALL of it away for college... I could certainly see putting half of it towards college though.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
boys

[/ QUOTE ] ?

[/ QUOTE ]

You clearly missed the point.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

you should teach him pot odds for his 10th birthday

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

While I think the college savings idea is a good one, the bigger issue is whether a 9 year old should be playing this much poker, or if he should be playing any at all.

I didn't play with any frequency until my freshman year of college, and my parents were still concerned about it then. Basically, you and your wife know your kid better than anyone. Make sure he has other interests and this isn't cutting into school/social/athletic/other interests. If you feel that it is then be willing to step in.

I'd recommend setting limits on how much to play each week. You don't even need to tell him, just if he's playing a lot come up with something else to do. As he gets older, you can loosen up the restrictions a little more. I think your wife's concerns are valid though, I've seen people much older than that get carried away with this stuff.

I'll mention that I'm only about ten years older than your son and (hopefully) far away from the parenting world. However, having been that age fairly recently it's my two cents.

-SonnyJay

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

Hearing a story like this convinces me to teach my 15 year old brother how to play. I will start over thanksgiving break and have him being a winning player over xmas break.

As far as your son in concerned, I think you should be proud because he is clearly smarter than a lot of people in this world and will do well in almost anything he would put his mind to it seems. I think with teaching him now he gains a lot of potential not just in poker just by the mere fact he is "learning." Which is why I would think you should continue how you are doing it.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
As well as not being interested in sports, he'll also likely not get interested in:

alcohol
drugs
sex
boys

and a whole list of other things you might be concerned about.

[/ QUOTE ]

Worst. Argument. Ever.

The boys part made me laugh out loud tho.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
you should teach him pot odds for his 10th birthday

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

You sound like a reasonable parent.

I think taking $1000 out of his $1100 is just plain meaningless. He'll be devastated.

Teach him the importance of saving, and let ("persuade") him

to make the decision to save x% of his earnings for a college

fund.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

I say sell him.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I say sell him.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was thinking something along the same lines as well.

Something for profit and exploitation for sure.

American Idol
Chess
Spelling Bees

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I say sell him.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll buy him.* I've been meaning to invest some of my poker winnings.



*Sale contingent on him being able to at least 4 table.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Your wife is a wise person by the sounds of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

Be careful OP. This type of thing leads to divorce and restricted visiting rights. Believe me, I know.

If bad things go down, Boy is going to ask you someday "Dad, is it true you and Mom split cuz you let me play poker?"

Have him learn chess.

[/ QUOTE ]
I can pretty much guarntee you that if your wife files for divorce that this gambling will single handedly lose you any custody battle.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

Playing that young is illegal isn't it? Or is that being picky?

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

I think this is awesome. As long as you give him guidance I don't see why he would get addicted. It's just a game to him, and you have to set limits. Obviously he should not be allowed to play by himself until a long time.

Of course you could teach him chess, but poker can teach him money management and investing skills. It could do him good in the future to learn these things now. However, don't let it consume physical activities he should be doing as a kid. You have to be in control of the situation.

Even so, if your wife doesn't agree you may have to give it up until he gets older. You would lose in a custody battle (if for some reason you got a divorce). If she has the train of thought that gambling, even at a responsible level, is bad then she won't realize the good in it.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]


I think taking $1000 out of his $1100 is just plain meaningless. He'll be devastated.



[/ QUOTE ]

He wont be devistated. He will still be doing something he obviously considers fun with his dad (EV+ than 1000 cashmoney) PLUS the money that is actually in the bank and working for him while he makes MORE money playing quality poker.


I'm also assuming he is literate? Perhaps getting a book like TPFAP or HOH and reading them together could be EV+ for the both of you.

I realize that he is making good money at this already, but try to emphasise the positives of poker (i.e cognitive thinking, math skills, money mangement, and pure logic). I personally don't see why you woldn't want to invest some of that money(1000) into a kid that will most defiately pay off in the high I.Q market.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Have him learn chess.

[/ QUOTE ] Because no marriages ever spilt over father's obsessions with their children's chess careers, eh? How much time do you spend around first generation E Euro or Russian immigrants famlies?

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

Jesus, let the kid keep playing for as long as he enjoys it (although limit how much time he can spend playing each day, he needs to do regular kid stuff too). Encourage him to invest most of the profits he doesn't need for his BR (ie don't let him spend too much). That chunk of cash can grow to a pretty nice amount over the years.

"She thinks playing poker for money for a nine year old is unhealthy and is afraid that he is going to become addicted to gambling?"

Rubbish. I used to play cards for lunch money when I was a kid, and I don't have any gambling problems. My problem is getting myself to actually PLAY.

"She's afraid that he will lose interest in activities that nine years old normally participate in, ie, baseball, soccor, riding a bicycle etc. although that has not happened."

This is important. He sounds fine, but just make sure poker stays casual. As good as it'd be for him to make a decent amount of money, it's much more important to be a 9yr old.

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'm also assuming he is literate?

[/ QUOTE ]

lol

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
how is this a dick move?? do you remember having 1000 dollars when you were 9.. Imagine the education you could have paid for had you invested a simple 1000 at age 9 into some sort of rolling CD's or into a 10 year trust. But your right, trading a future for a chance to move up to the 20's is the right move.

But im just a donk

[/ QUOTE ]

1000 after 10 years will be 4000 if he's lucky. Not much to get excited about considering how much college will cost in 10 years.

Whether I let him keep playing depends on what his attitude is. Does he want to learn the skill to beat the games? Or is he interested in the "gamble"?

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

We have made multiple trips to the bank to deposit money into his college or car fund. Even though he would like the money himself and do what he pleases he's happy that the money is being put away for him for future endeavors.
I will not allow him direct access to the money.

Twenty games a week may sound like a lot, but he's a kid whose bouncing a basketball or hitting a baseball a good portion of the time, so I don't see this interfering with other activities. He's a very good athlete and he love's to fish. He really doesn't like to play video games at
all. He finds it boring. So from my perspective I don't
see this affecting his development. His math skills have gotten a whole lot better as a result of poker. He can
multiply and divide big numbers and he understands percentages. He still doesn't quite understand pot odds but we're working on it.

He began playing gin about four years ago and he used to beat his grandparents for a quarter a game religiously. They refuse to play him now because they lose almost everytime.

I will not let him play unless I'm around and I am always in the room with him either reading or watching sports and I'm always sitting next to him so I'm not using poker as a substitute for parenting.

Thanks for the feedback.

Bruce

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

And to the people who said this should be college money, rubbish. This is where his investments should start. Dad should still pay for college (better play those sngs [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]) so the son can develop a good financial base at an early age.

BTW, does anyone else think this is funny that we have an 8 and 9 yo in this thread that beat adults in poker [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Wonder what they'd all say when they found out our guys aren't even into double digits. I love it...

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Have him learn chess.

[/ QUOTE ]

He's too old to start and be any good.

Yugoslav

Re: What to do with a Child who plays SNG\'s?
 

BTW your child sitting in front of video games all day is something to worry about alot more. At least what he's doing is productive. The only thing video games can do is give someone good multitabling skills. I'm glad my Ps never bought me a nintendo or mega drive (had to save for a n64 myself).