Steelers vs Vikings
 

Anyone watching this game? Steelers are playing stupid as usual.

First, 2nd and goal from the 2, after a 6 yard run by Bettis on first down, and they try PA. WTF? 3rd down the snap is fumbled and they get a FG.

Now, [censored] Randle El doesn't move away from a fair catch call, falls on his butt, and the ball hits him in the helmet. Vikings recover at the 3 yard line.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

At least our D has shown up so far today. Huge stop!

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

Have faith. They look much better in the second half. Big saftey there...

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
At least our D has shown up so far today. Huge stop!

[/ QUOTE ]

Pretty easy to play defense when Brad Johnson is doing his best Culpepper impersonation.

Nice fvcking interceptions...

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
Anyone watching this game? Steelers are playing stupid as usual.

First, 2nd and goal from the 2, after a 6 yard run by Bettis on first down, and they try PA. WTF? 3rd down the snap is fumbled and they get a FG.

Now, [censored] Randle El doesn't move away from a fair catch call, falls on his butt, and the ball hits him in the helmet. Vikings recover at the 3 yard line.

[/ QUOTE ]

* checks score * (18-3 Pitt)
* ignores OP *

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

Fine, ignore me, it still doesn't change the fact they played horribly to start and the coaching decisions were BAD.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
and the coaching decisions were BAD.

[/ QUOTE ]
business as usual for cowher, no?

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
and the coaching decisions were BAD.

[/ QUOTE ]
business as usual for cowher, no?

[/ QUOTE ]


*checks Bill Cowhers all-time W/L* (139-82)
*ignores another user*

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

Bill still shits his pants in the big games.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
and the coaching decisions were BAD.

[/ QUOTE ]
business as usual for cowher, no?

[/ QUOTE ]


*checks Bill Cowhers all-time W/L* (139-82)
*ignores another user*

[/ QUOTE ]

You're obviously someone who doesn't know football so you have to go by numbers.

Cowher, as usual, made several bad decisions in that game. He has a list a mile long of bad decisions this year.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

So how would you do things differently? Not trying to stir up junk, but I am honestly curious. I'm a big steeler fan as well, but I'm not as down on Cowher as you.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

What a horrible game, god damn you Vikings.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
and the coaching decisions were BAD.

[/ QUOTE ]
business as usual for cowher, no?

[/ QUOTE ]


*checks Bill Cowhers all-time W/L* (139-82)
*ignores another user*

[/ QUOTE ]

You're obviously someone who doesn't know football so you have to go by numbers.

Cowher, as usual, made several bad decisions in that game. He has a list a mile long of bad decisions this year.

[/ QUOTE ]

He makes horrible decisions every game. He is a terrible offensive coach. His play calling is insanely conservative(besides wacky onside kicks in stupid situations). He is blessed with an ability to hone very good defenses and motivates players as well as any coach in the league - but the offensive scheme leaves me befuddled every week.
-James

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

I understand that the head coach is ultimatly responsible for the team, but is not the offense called by Mike Mularkey? Shouldn't he be the one taking the heat for much of the offensive woes??

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

Guys,

a coach making a bad decision is like a batter making an out - every coach makes a lot of em.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
I understand that the head coach is ultimatly responsible for the team, but is not the offense called by Mike Mularkey? Shouldn't he be the one taking the heat for much of the offensive woes??

[/ QUOTE ]

Ken Whisenhunt, isn't it?

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

Damm. How ignorant am I? Ugh. You are absolutly right. Was reading the Buffalo game recap.... sorry... same question, different person then...

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
So how would you do things differently? Not trying to stir up junk, but I am honestly curious. I'm a big steeler fan as well, but I'm not as down on Cowher as you.

[/ QUOTE ]

I tried describing it in my first post on this thread but maybe I wasn't clear.

1st and goal from the 8 - 6 yard run by Bettis
2nd and goal from the 2 - PA pass?!?!

Are you serious? Why even have Bettis on the team if on 1st down he runs for 6 and you don't give him the ball on 2nd down?

Everything eventually goes thru Cowher so I don't buy the "he doesn't call the plays" stuff.

This same mistake was repeated later in the game. He never learns.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

I don't claim to be an offensive coach, but I really don't see the big problem with the call. The entire stadium think you're going to pound the ball, the only thing you don't want to do is take a sack or throw an int. If you don't make it, you can come back and still run the rock on 3rd dow, where the defense has to be unsure whether or not you'll run or pass. Perhaps I'm being naive, but it doesn't seem unreasonable to PA there...

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

It's very unreasonable for really any team, but especially the Steelers who are a running team. Why try to get "cute" there? Bettis just got you 6 easy yards when they had the box stacked. Running is the ONLY option you should even be considering at that point.

While my reasoning has nothing to do with the result, you saw just how well that PA pass worked out...

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

I think it is better to call the PA on 2nd than third down, and if they hadn't screwed up the snap on 3rd, maybe it would have opened it up a little more.

I agree that running Bettis 3 times up the middle is never a bad idea, but I don't think that the play call was terrible.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

I suppose I can see your point, but (and this is a moot point now) would you be screaming as loudly if they ran on 2nd and 3rd down, and got stuffed like they did to the Vikes? Just tryin to understand your thinking...

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
I suppose I can see your point, but (and this is a moot point now) would you be screaming as loudly if they ran on 2nd and 3rd down, and got stuffed like they did to the Vikes? Just tryin to understand your thinking...

[/ QUOTE ]

Not at all, because the Steelers live & die by the run. They die, when they try to get "cute". There's no reason to get "cute" when it is not needed, and in that situation, it wasn't needed.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So how would you do things differently? Not trying to stir up junk, but I am honestly curious. I'm a big steeler fan as well, but I'm not as down on Cowher as you.

[/ QUOTE ]

I tried describing it in my first post on this thread but maybe I wasn't clear.

1st and goal from the 8 - 6 yard run by Bettis
2nd and goal from the 2 - PA pass?!?!

Are you serious? Why even have Bettis on the team if on 1st down he runs for 6 and you don't give him the ball on 2nd down?

Everything eventually goes thru Cowher so I don't buy the "he doesn't call the plays" stuff.

This same mistake was repeated later in the game. He never learns.

[/ QUOTE ]

Iggy,

I watched the entire game except for that first drive
(first bar I tried was closed so had to go to a backup) so I didn't see the actual series being discussed. However, in this situations I like sometimes calling play action there. It's fairly likely to be successful because the other team is expecting a run. Calling a PA pass sometimes in that spot will also force the other team to play the pass a bit more making the run more likely to be successful. Finally, and this is where I disagree with Cowher and most NFL coaches, if you make an incomplete pass you can give it to Bus two more times.

Given that Cowher wouldn't go for it on fourth down unless it's very short, I would prefer two runs in that spot as well.

What actually happened? I saw Big Ben fumble a snap was that on second or third? I'm assuming the pass was incomplete and 3rd down was fumbled. Either way I think sometimes calling PA and sometimes running is good, going for it on fourth down if it's less than 3 in either case.

Also, if we're giving him the blame, I think Cowher did really well on several calls later in the game when we were ahead and some nice pass plays worked with the defense clearly pushing up to stop the run. I also thought the switching between Bettis and Parker was done well this game, sometimes I wonder feel like the wrong guy is out there but this game that went well.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with a PA pass, but not after Bettis runs for 6 yards on first down and not in the beginning of the game when you're trying to setup that you're going to pound the ball all damn day. It's about setting a tone in the game. To me, that's the Steelers saying they don't think they can pound 2 yards out of the Vikings. If you ask every NFL team, I'd be willing to bet they'd all rather see the Steelers pass on down & goals than run the ball with Bettis. Teams FEAR Bettis & the Steelers running game close to the endzone.

What happened was Minne got pressure, Ben rolled out and was almost picked off trying to throw across his body. 3rd down was the fumbled snap and they kicked the FG.

The other down & goal situation was Bettis on 3 consecutive runs gets a first down and it's first and goal from the 4. The Steelers then run a trap on first down (and I may add a HORRIBLE call to ever run a trap with Bettis). He was stopped for no gain, which then led to a 3 step drop pass all the way on second down, to which Ben rolled out and scored.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

Iggy,

In terms of what might or might not be a big mistake, the PA Pass is not exactly an egregious error. You've got a great passing game with big targets like Hines and Heath Miller.

Re: Steelers vs Vikings
 

[ QUOTE ]
Iggy,

In terms of what might or might not be a big mistake, the PA Pass is not exactly an egregious error. You've got a great passing game with big targets like Hines and Heath Miller.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you're missing what I'm saying. The Steelers come off of a game where they completely destroyed one of the best defenses in the league from constant pounding of the ball. They got back to "Steelers Football", something they were missing during that 3-game slide.

All week you hear about how they're going to pound the ball against Minnesota like they did Chicago. There's nothing more demoralizing to a defense than when they know you're running, yet they can't stop you because you just keep pounding them with it. This is Steelers football.

Steelers football is not calling a PA pass on 2nd and goal in the beginning of a game. There's nothing demoralizing there, there's no pounding. That's not Steelers football. When they lose their identity, they lose games.