2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

Stars 2/4 Me $500 villian $440
No real reads as I have only just sat down.

MP limps, button(villain)makes it $16, I make it $65 red KK. MP folds,Button makes it 120, I call?

($248) Flop 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

Because of the way the hand was played pre flop is there no way not getting it all in the middle?

Sorry if this is so standard just think I am missing something very basic. Does anyone fold after he four bets preflop?

Re: 2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

3rd raise preflop online always has been AA in my experiences. With no read, I would fold the flop and move on to the next hand.

Re: 2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

check-raise all-in on the flop, especially if you have an aggressive image.

Re: 2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

[ QUOTE ]
Because of the way the hand was played pre flop is there no way not getting it all in the middle?

[/ QUOTE ]
Considering stack sizes, the decision in this hand is definitely when you call his last re-raise. No way you can put in >25% of your stack in PF and get away from it now. Check/raise all in looks good.

As far as folding PF.... I need one hell of a read. People always say that the 4 bet is always AA, but I've seen AK, QQ, etc in this spot enough times that I still never get away from KK pre-flop.

As a side note, I think I need to use the pre-flop 4-bet more often if people are seriously considering laying down KK to it.

Re: 2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

They may consider folding KK, but they don't actually do it.

Re: 2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

Preflop looks good. On the flop I would bet out 160 or so and of course call a raise. If he just calls I put in the rest on the turn.

Re: 2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

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They may consider folding KK, but they don't actually do it.

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Perhaps, but doesn't this mean that they do fold QQ a large portion of the time and JJ- pretty much every time?

Re: 2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

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[ QUOTE ]
They may consider folding KK, but they don't actually do it.

[/ QUOTE ]
Perhaps, but doesn't this mean that they do fold QQ a large portion of the time and JJ- pretty much every time?

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Some definitely do.

Results
 

I check raised all in on the flop, he had AA.

Re: 2/4 KK in SB Need Line
 

[ QUOTE ]
As a side note, I think I need to use the pre-flop 4-bet more often if people are seriously considering laying down KK to it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Most people aren't 2+2ers.

You're also overlooking the risk:reward... this needs to be successful more than half of the time just to be breakeven. Even if your opponent folds everything but AA, you have to consider that they really will have AA pretty frequently here. Most players aren't making big reraises from the blinds without a premium hand. JJ and AK call there a lot.