PP NL100 KK against a tightie
 

Alright, so another KK hand. Here goes.

This time, the Villain is a tightie to the tune of 9% VPIP and 4% PFR over 300 hands.

I haven't seen him do much so far. Please critique my play and let me know your action on the river.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (10 handed) converter

saw flop|<font color="#C00000">saw showdown</font>

CO ($155.8)
Hero ($104.35)
SB ($232.05)
BB ($97)
UTG ($27.85)
UTG+1 ($96)
UTG+2 ($43.65)
MP1 ($190.95)
Villain ($106.05)
MP3 ($102.35)

Preflop: Hero is Button with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls $1, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Villain raises to $3</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO calls $3, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $10</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, UTG folds, Villain calls $7, CO folds.

Flop: ($25.50) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Villain checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $12</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Villain raises to $24</font>, Hero calls $12.

Turn: ($73.50) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Villain bets $20</font>, Hero calls $20.

River: ($113.50) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Villain instantly bets $52.05 (All-In)</font>, Hero ??

What's the move this time?

KoW

Re: PP NL100 KK against a tightie
 

it almost feels like AQ to me here. and I'd call that. The raise which doubled from $12 to $24 smelled of him prying for information cheaply, not that of a set. Because he opened for a raise preflop.

Re: PP NL100 KK against a tightie
 

I don't see how this guy can be checkingraising the flop with anything you beat.

Re: PP NL100 KK against a tightie
 

Respect his raise, put him on more than a pair (Id say QQQ), and muck the hand.

You will have better opportunities in other hands.

EDIT: This is given that he is very tight. A loose cannon I may call.

-Google-

What to do, What to do?
 

I don't see a tightie (4%PFR) raising with AQ or calling a reraise with it preflop. I also don't see AQ check-raising that flop unless he has seen you make alot of continuation bets lately. Did he hesitate with the check-raise or was it instant like he planned it? (in other words, did he decide you were bluffing after thinking about it or was he waiting on the edge of his computer chair waiting for a chance to baby bump ya?) If we can peg him as a tight player then we would probably be able to remove AQ from his possibles.

What does that leave us with? Tightwad isn't going to raise preflop with 88 or 55. He would with QQ and AA or maybe JJ and he is over his head and trying to make you lay it down (distant possibility). I am putting him on QQ with the PFR, not reraising your PFR (as he MIGHT with AA), bumping a little to get you pot committed on the flop, not worried about protecting anything with his mediocre turn bet, pushing when he fills up on the river. Seems like an easy read based on the information you gave us. I just can't see him playing this fast with any hand that you beat. Now do I make that read when I only have 15 seconds to decide? Nope, I call with my Kings and buy back in. A more disciplined player than myself would easily lay down overpair with this much action from a tight player.

Da Fly

PS- I could be completely wrong.

Re: What to do, What to do?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't see a tightie (4%PFR) raising with AQ or calling a reraise with it preflop. I also don't see AQ check-raising that flop unless he has seen you make alot of continuation bets lately. Did he hesitate with the check-raise or was it instant like he planned it? (in other words, did he decide you were bluffing after thinking about it or was he waiting on the edge of his computer chair waiting for a chance to baby bump ya?) If we can peg him as a tight player then we would probably be able to remove AQ from his possibles.

What does that leave us with? Tightwad isn't going to raise preflop with 88 or 55. He would with QQ and AA or maybe JJ and he is over his head and trying to make you lay it down (distant possibility). I am putting him on QQ with the PFR, not reraising your PFR (as he MIGHT with AA), bumping a little to get you pot committed on the flop, not worried about protecting anything with his mediocre turn bet, pushing when he fills up on the river. Seems like an easy read based on the information you gave us. I just can't see him playing this fast with any hand that you beat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ya this is the exact thought process I went through.... by the time the river got there [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

I'm kinda pissed at myself that I couldn't figure all that out by the time the flop check raise got there. At the time, the check min raise seemed like a feeler to see if I had AK. Of course, I convinced myself at the time that's why I should call. Then when he underbets the turn, I felt almost obligated to call. After the river push the pea-brain finally processed all the stuff you basically described, then I realized I had better muck. (so I did, obviously)

I think this is an example of the biggest leak in my game and I made this post to both "punish" myself and hopefully make others aware that it could be a problem in their game too. Anyone else find themselves going through this during a hand?

KoW

Re: PP NL100 KK against a tightie
 

My gut instinct says QQQ88

Re: PP NL100 KK against a tightie
 

I often go through the 'no way could he have hit the set'. My problem is it often starts out as, this f'in donk is check raising me with AQ....he's betting out into me with a small 1/4 sized bet, now I'll smooth call...flop...oh $#^$.

My problem is, half the time I call because I think these guys are full of crap. Especially on Party...problem is, once in a while I'm right, so it keeps me at it. I'm an ass...a leaky one at that.

I feel your pain, thanks for the post.

Re: PP NL100 KK against a tightie
 

im assuming by his tightness that he has a low WTSD%, correct?? did you consider min raising the turn?

Re: PP NL100 KK against a tightie
 

Fold on the flop.