Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

No you can't, you aren't deep stacked enough.

The button is awful anyways. Flat calling with KK, blech.

Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

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I don't know if it is possible to avoid doubling up the button. But I don't like your CR on the flop. What if villain checks, you've given him a free card in case he is on a draw. I think a half pot bet on the flop is best. He will likely raise you and maybe you can fold

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That's my point, I'm not folding here. The check was bad. Once he bet, I should have just C/R'd all-in immediately.

I was pretty sure he'd bet, and there were so many cards that I wouldn't really like on the turn, so I figured I'd C/R. Meh.

Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

This thread comforted me.

I often shrug my shoulders and put it in the center...

Sometimes I look like a doneky ass who can't fold TP...sometimes I doulbe through early...seems the latter happens more often...but those strectch of the former make you question yourself sometimes...

Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

c/r is godawful on this flop, especially considering stack sizes/pf action

from what i see, so many people here overuse the c/r when a lead is way better in a lot of situations

Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

[ QUOTE ]
c/r is godawful on this flop, especially considering stack sizes/pf action

from what i see, so many people here overuse the c/r when a lead is way better in a lot of situations

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Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

i consider this to be a coinflip like situation, not this exact hand, but hands like these where u have big hands and your oponents also have big hands. If u lose w/ KK to AA or AA to KK, it's a coinflip, if u switch players then the outcome would be the same-- this is NOT where your ROI comes from, it comes from players who misplay their good/bad hands.

it's not how u play big hands vs big hands that provide the largest % of your ROI, it's how u play big hands vs poor hands (read players), bubble play, and table selection.

Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

[ QUOTE ]
c/r is godawful on this flop, especially considering stack sizes/pf action

from what i see, so many people here overuse the c/r when a lead is way better in a lot of situations

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Look, I admit that the check was not great, but to say C/R is godawful is a bit much. I mean, the pot was heads-up. Must I fear a flush draw every time two of a suit comes on a flop? Yes, there are potential draws out there, but IF if am certain (I know you can never be totally sure) that if I check, villain will bet, then what would be so bad with putting him all in with a C/R to make him pay for his draw? If he's ahead (as was the case here), then the point is moot either way. If he's behind, I'm getting all my money in with the best hand.

This is all predicated on his likelihood of betting if I check. If I could be sure of a bet, a C/R all-in seems perfectly fine to me. What's wrong with getting as much money in as possible with the best hand?

Again, I would never check here in a multi-way pot.

Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

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FWIW, I don't play Kings the way button did, I hate giving infinite odds for villain to hit his ace.

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On the other hand, if you think you have an overaggressive villain who will fire repeated shots here with AQ but laydown if you make a move, this is a great way to extract with KK. It's hard to look at some of these things in a vacuum.

Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

You are obviously doomed once that flop comes. I dont raise it preflop but thats just me.

Re: The nature of 800 chip games
 

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You are obviously doomed once that flop comes. I dont raise it preflop but thats just me.

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Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. Would you call the pre-flop raise a mistake?