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-   -   Nut flush draw against two made straights? (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=215475)

jeffraider 03-18-2005 04:53 AM

Nut flush draw against two made straights?
 
I just don't know about this hand. Last one for the night, I promise. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I was fairly sure that I was up against a pair of made straights here from the flop action. Should that have made me fold, being that I was a 2:1 dog to make my flush? I was getting 2:1 on every dollar until DrDoom ran out of money, then it was 1:1 with the big stack. Hmmmm.

#Game No : 1753096806
***** Hand History for Game 1753096806 *****
$25 PL Omaha Hi - Friday, March 18, 03:48:19 EDT 2005
Table Table 37264 (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 5: lanano29_3 ( $66.19 )
Seat 1: jeffraiderSA ( $46.9 )
Seat 7: Pumping_Pete ( $24.25 )
Seat 8: acesup78 ( $18.25 )
Seat 3: FugginTrips ( $31.8 )
Seat 2: riff73 ( $27.15 )
Seat 4: bjcrow ( $39.15 )
Seat 10: drdoom52 ( $23.9 )
Seat 9: xd248 ( $0 )
bjcrow posts small blind [$0.1].
lanano29_3 posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to jeffraiderSA [ J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ]
xd248 has left the table.
acesup78 folds.
drdoom52 calls [$0.25].
jeffraiderSA calls [$0.25].
riff73 folds.
FugginTrips folds.
bjcrow calls [$0.15].
lanano29_3 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ]
bjcrow checks.
lanano29_3 bets [$0.5].
drdoom52 raises [$2.5].
>You have options at Table 37545 Table!.
jeffraiderSA calls [$2.5].
bjcrow folds.
lanano29_3 raises [$10.5].
drdoom52 raises [$17].
jeffraiderSA calls [$17].
lanano29_3 is all-In [$54.94]
>You have options at Table 37545 Table!.
drdoom52 is all-In [$4.15]
jeffraiderSA is all-In [$27.15]
** Dealing Turn ** [ K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ]
** Dealing River ** [ 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ]
<font color="white">
drdoom52 shows [ T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ] a straight, nine to king.
jeffraiderSA shows [ J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ] a pair of jacks.
lanano29_3 shows [ 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ] a straight, nine to king.
lanano29_3 wins $19.29 from side pot #2 with a straight, nine to king.
lanano29_3 wins $46 from side pot #1 with a straight, nine to king.
drdoom52 wins $34.47 from the main pot with a straight, nine to king.
lanano29_3 wins $34.48 from the main pot with a straight, nine to king. </font>

Hattifnatt 03-18-2005 06:07 AM

Re: Nut flush draw against two made straights?
 
Preflop the call is not so obvius, at least not in a higher game...

Flop you must of course call the first raise but then it might be better to fold because you don't have any additional outs other than a runnerfull with Top pair. The situation would have been other if you had a gutshot to the nuts with the nutflushdraw. Or if you was against ONE opponent though then he can have top2 and you have a shot at a higher 2pair...

Even if you are 2:1 to get your flush someone with a set can fill up on the turn or river and then your flush is worthless.

Bartholow 03-18-2005 10:04 AM

Re: Nut flush draw against two made straights?
 
I think it is obvious by the time you have to call the really big bets that they do in fact both have the straight. This means a set is pretty unlikely, not quite impossible but probably means calling all-in with the nut flush draw is ok IMHO. You would prefer a little more dead money in there to give you some overlay.

I also think this hand should be mucked preflop.

Cleveland Guy 03-18-2005 10:35 AM

Re: Nut flush draw against two made straights?
 
I think your discounting a guy here having both the made straight and a set. a hand like 99TQ, QJJT- etc.

All are reasonable holdings, could let the guy holding this freeroll towards his boat.

Bartholow 03-18-2005 06:17 PM

Re: Nut flush draw against two made straights?
 
Yeah, but it's just not very likely. Occasionally you will run into that yes, but very rarely.

WSOPWinner2005 03-19-2005 03:10 AM

Re: Nut flush draw against two made straights?
 
I had one of those straights and to be honest I knew exactly what you had when you called his re-raise and was going to make you pay every penny for that draw. I am really suprised you stayed in.

You had no redraws, all you were going for was the nut flush draw - I don't see how this can be a good play on flop unless you are getting 4:1 which you weren't by any means here.

I would like to know, do others think this was a good set of calls he made here honestly??

P.S. You played a solid game overall at both tables I was at with you and this is the only hand I didn't understand your play on.


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