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-   -   TP with a Draw (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=321249)

Jester999 08-23-2005 04:09 PM

TP with a Draw
 
No reads. First orbit. $100 NL Party Poker

UTG limps, UTG+1 ($100) min raises, UTG +2 ($30) calls, I ($100) call with Jc 9c, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop is:
4c, 9h, 5c

Check, check, UTG+1 bets $4, UTG+2 makes it $15 to go.

Action's on you. Got a plan?

zambonidrivr 08-23-2005 04:32 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
fold preflop, and it's not even close.

Jester999 08-23-2005 04:32 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
[ QUOTE ]
fold preflop, and it's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not the question.

zambonidrivr 08-23-2005 04:38 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
alright fine. top pair is not good. i think you would agree with that. if it is, someone is telling you it isn't. i am not sure about you, but the overbet usually says something at such micro limits. hard to tell from your details but it costs you 14-15 to call a pot of 20 something? thats less than 2:1 and not giving you proper odds to draw to the 4th best flush. i get out especially as this is the first orbit and you don't likely have reads on these donks yet.

so you pushed right....? what happened?

zambonidrivr 08-23-2005 04:42 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
in addition, there are others to act behind you. semi bluffing is good against 1 opponent, maybe 2 if they are both donks, but 3? utg check is suspicious.

Jester999 08-23-2005 04:45 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
Okay...here I'll help you a bit for clarity. The pot on the flop is $10 (5 players x $2 a piece). Then on the flop the pfr bets $4 and is raised to $15. Okay, this is where it gets tricky. If you add $10 (original pot) + $4 (initial post flop bet) + $15 (the raise)= $29 in the middle. $15 to me. And no, I don't think top pair is good.

Back to you, Brunson.

Jester999 08-23-2005 04:47 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
[ QUOTE ]
utg check is suspicious.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why? He limped called in a multiway pot. What's so suspicious about that?

Jester999 08-23-2005 04:48 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
[ QUOTE ]
in addition, there are others to act behind you. semi bluffing is good against 1 opponent, maybe 2 if they are both donks, but 3? utg check is suspicious.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. Semi-bluffing multiple players is suicidal unless your draw is huge. This one is not. It's rather weak.

zambonidrivr 08-23-2005 04:55 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
Thanks Daniel. Still not getting odds, and you still have players to act behind. Since there are 2 diamonds on the board so anyone is a jackass to not lead out with trips (IMHO), so to your point, utg 1 that checked the flop is a moron, unless he was sure someone would raise this pot with the intention to raising. in short scottie, u don't have much, and your draw could be dead. these low stakes games are a joke and so easy to beat. don't get caught in a bad spot when you can crush these people playing good solid poker.

doyle

ScottTheFish 08-23-2005 05:05 PM

Re: TP with a Draw
 
[ QUOTE ]
fold preflop, and it's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're right about it not being close. Easy call unless the table has been unusually aggressive preflop. It's at least 3 way and at least 1 of the blinds will come along. I'm on the button. Cheap minraise. I'll look at a flop here every time.

And this is pretty much the flop we're looking for. Unfortunately they're going crazy in front of me. I don't love a 9 or J because there could already be a set out...So really all I have is my flush draw. Fold equity is minimal at best. with no reads I'm tempted to fold. If I play I need to push and I don't want to play for my stack here.


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