Playalong JJ
 

Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, BB calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG caps</font>, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (12.50 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero?

<font color="white"> for those confused by PF action, it was actually 8 handed </font>

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Raises -100, Calls -1, Folds -0

Re: Playalong JJ
 

[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (8 handed)

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

What about call flop/raise turn? Raising the flop isn't going to fold anybody who isn't drawing super-slim anyway.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

reads?

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Raise.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

NL, my default line is to raise the flop and calldown if 3bet (obviously depending on future action). I like raising the flop because it gives BB about 8:1 which is enough to make calling with a 3 outer incorrect. Also, if you're behind to UTG it costs you less.

I can see some arguments for other lines though. Waiting until the turn to raise will allow you to cut BB's odds further if you are ahead. However, unless you are prepared to fold to a 3bet, this line is more expensive. An advantage is that you can choose not the raise if the turn is a bad card (an A or K for example).

You will be ahead often enough that you should raise somewhere for protection and value, and I prefer raising the flop.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (8 handed)

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP.

[/ QUOTE ]

Go back and read the <font color="white">whole </font> post plz.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

[ QUOTE ]
reads?

[/ QUOTE ]

none other than that UTG is getting fairly low on money. Hes got about 4.5BB left going into the flop. (however I didnt notice this till the turn)

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Now that I think about it, if you are ahead of UTG, he and BB will share outs. In other words, BB will rarely have a true 3 outer (he will if he holds Kx and UTG holds AQ for instance). I think this makes waiting until the turn to raise more appealing.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Huh? I did, like 3 times. I see 3 active players and 5 folders. I couldn't give a sh!t if it's 14 handed, I was just breaking your balls.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

The fact that it's 8 handed changes things a fair bit I just assumed it was SH, I probably still think raising is good, but I think BB's call could be slightly more rational hand here 8handed so waiting for the turn could be better.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Sometimes I raise flop sometimes wait for the turn, I raised the flop here because I thought I might get BB to fold overs and I wanted to find out where I was at vs UTG now rather than the turn.

Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (8 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, BB calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG caps</font>, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (12.50 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, Hero calls, BB calls.

Turn: (10.75 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero ???

At this point UTG has $54 left. Given that, should I be popping the turn to try to get rid of BB?

Re: Playalong JJ
 

[ QUOTE ]
Huh? I did, like 3 times. I see 3 active players and 5 folders. I couldn't give a sh!t if it's 14 handed, I was just breaking your balls.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah I know, I was just pointing out that I mentioned that it was 8 handed in white in the OP [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Ohhhhhh, now I feel dumb.

Don't use white. It sucks cause you can't see it.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Given that flop action, you should just call on the turn now. BB's outs aren't that threatening when you're most likely losing to UTG's hand. Invite the BB in for a single bet and play the hand cheaply. UTG had enough money at the start of the hand where it looks like he's not overplaying just to go all in.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Well no one seems too interested in the turn, but I popped it and surprisingly BB insta called and UTG mucked. On to the river.

Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (8 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, BB calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG caps</font>, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (12.50 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, Hero calls, BB calls.

Turn: (10.75 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls, UTG folds.

River: (15.75 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, Hero ??

Re: Playalong JJ
 

Looks like an easy check, but it depends a little bit on BB of course.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

this seems to me like the easiest check in the world. i am very interested in hearing why it might not be. maybe some think it should be "easy" to fold to a c/r, but I don't like putting myself in the position of having to make the decision for one more bet in a 17bb pot, especially when there really arent many hands he can just call with that i beat.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

[ QUOTE ]
Well no one seems too interested in the turn, but I popped it and surprisingly BB insta called and UTG mucked. On to the river.

[/ QUOTE ]
I get to wake up to this? UTG folded??? F'in weird. Poker players are strange sometimes.

BB could very easily be playing a passive QQ-AA or looking to c/r a completed flush. I'd check behind because those combos are greater than 99, TT and the remote A7 or A8. Bet/folding into a pot this size would be insane. Bet/calling is OK, but not as good as checking behind IMO.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

[ QUOTE ]
this seems to me like the easiest check in the world. i am very interested in hearing why it might not be. maybe some think it should be "easy" to fold to a c/r, but I don't like putting myself in the position of having to make the decision for one more bet in a 17bb pot, especially when there really arent many hands he can just call with that i beat.

[/ QUOTE ]

the case I can make for betting is that since his hand looks so much like spades, I think it is very likely that he realizes his hand looks like spades and would donk if he made a flush. however, like you said, he could have a lot of other non spade hands that are still beating me, which is what pushed me back in the direction of checking.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Well no one seems too interested in the turn, but I popped it and surprisingly BB insta called and UTG mucked. On to the river.

[/ QUOTE ]
I get to wake up to this? UTG folded??? F'in weird. Poker players are strange sometimes.

BB could very easily be playing a passive QQ-AA or looking to c/r a completed flush. I'd check behind because those combos are greater than 99, TT and the remote A7 or A8. Bet/folding into a pot this size would be insane. Bet/calling is OK, but not as good as checking behind IMO.

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Yeah I cannot figure out wtf UTG could have possibly had. Especially considering he had 50 bucks left and the pot was huge.

IMO its either check or bet/call. I am not even willing to consider bet/fold.

Re: Playalong JJ
 

UTG has already illistrated why I like a bet. People are stupid. let him call with his 66 or A2c or whatever. sure the spades is scary, so what? its rare a river card isnt scary. bet that [censored]