Delayed stop and go with KK
 

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $10 BB (8 handed) converter

UTG ($486)
UTG+1 ($543)
MPA ($1591)
MP2 ($3020)
CO <font color="#A500AF">(villain)</font> ($1475)
Button ($985)
SB ($490)
BB ($222)

Preflop:
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, <font color="#CC3333">MPA raises to $35</font>, MP2 folds, <font color="#CC3333">CO <font color="#A500AF">(villain)</font> raises to $120</font>, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, MPA calls $85.

Flop: ($255) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
MPA checks, <font color="#CC3333">villain bets $200</font>, MPA calls $200.

Turn: ($655) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">MPA bets $300</font>, villain calls $300.

River: ($1255) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">MPA bets $500</font>, villain calls $500.

Final Pot: $2255

Good line? Stupid line that pot commits me only when I'm behind? Better lines?

-Evan

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

Does anyone here 3-bet preflop and then fold if he comes over the top?

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

bet more on the turn to more easily get the guy all in.

bet like 450-550 on the turn

why the heck didnt you push him in on the river? the pot was $1255, do you really think he wont call 350 more with hands he'll call 500 with?

personally, if i smooth call with KK, i love leading out at low flops like that bc they get real itchy to raise their JJ and QQ.

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

three betting w KK is one of the biggest mistakes in NL.

i assume you have read ciaffone's NL book?

if so, reread the preflop section on KK.

if not, buy it soon.

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

hmm, I'll have to reread that section, I remember old posts from Limon and others saying if you get it all in with KK and you're playing a deepstack you're almost always looking at AA, so it's a mistake to get it all in. But I thought you'd want to 3-bet and then assuming that when he comes back over the top it's AA. Interesting since I posted a hand a couple days ago where I had KK and everyone said my m istake was not putting the guy all-in preflop, granted he had a shortstack but still...

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

first of all $1,470 although a lot of money, is not a deep stack in this game. It's only 147BB's.

second, ill summarize the section.

if you put in the third bet with KK, you allow any decent opponent to play perfectly against you. he folds 99-QQ, and either reraises or traps you with AA.

think about it. MP opens for $40, you make it $100 from the CO, and the SB makes it $250. what range of hands are you calling, folding, and reraising with?

the SB just made the hand real easy for you to play.

if you raise preflop with KK and someone reraises you, there is little point in reraising in most situations. unless the guy is awful and will stack off with 1010-QQ or AK here.

hope this helps,

fsuplayer

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

Ive actually been toying with a small three-raise out of position in these situations and getting good results. I've done it about 6 tomes over the past few months and in five of the cases was just called and then called down by an overpair in another case the player came over the top and i folded, he showed AA. in position when getting limp re-raised i give my opposition credit for AA much easier and just call.

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

Curious - What Ciaffone book are you talking about? I have a couple of books by him (Improve your Poker and the book he wrote with Stewart) but I dont see a section on KK.

Thanks

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

its not an entire section on KK preflop. but he specifically says that about it. i wish i had my copy so i could find the page, but i dont have one with me here at home.

Re: Delayed stop and go with KK
 

Page 66 talks about it. I think thats the section you were refering to.