Stars VIP = Cash???
 

I was looking at the new FPP store on Stars, and while they offer a lot of nifty stuff, what I'd really like is some way to build the old 'roll. Does anybody have any suggestions? I was thinking about getting the buy-ins to the $500k, and keeping the T$, and selling those, but apparently those can't be redeemed for T$. so, does anybody have any ideas, besides hocking iPod nano's on ebay?

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

They obviously will never offer a direct points-->cash system, because then every other prize becomes worthless, because everybody will just take the cash.

So I would not hold your breath for a direct points-->cash program or any sort of system in which you can beat the system and turn points into cash, because what is the point of having a 100,000 point prize if everybody is going to cash in their points once they reach 1,000 or 5,000 or whatever.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

Concierge Service, order pure gold for all your FPPs (when you have loads obviously) and sell it off with minimal loss.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

That's a good question: what is the point? I don't see how Stars is benefiting from the prizes, except maybe from people saving FPPs more, which seems like small potatoes to them, and fairly easily kept by putting the cash redeem at 50 or 100k points.

I suspect there's a legal issue somewhere.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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That's a good question: what is the point? I don't see how Stars is benefiting from the prizes, except maybe from people saving FPPs more, which seems like small potatoes to them, and fairly easily kept by putting the cash redeem at 50 or 100k points.

I suspect there's a legal issue somewhere.

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My guess is by giving merchandise stars can buy at wholesale and sell at retail. Effectively your 15% rakeback might only cost stars 10%

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

Well they have gift certificates. That's about as close as you're get. Although it seems like a huge ripoff when compared to rakeback.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

i'm thinking about taking the dell cards, scouting for smoking hot dell deals, and flipping on ebay...

thoughts?

there are people doing this on fatwallet all the time with cash

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

Here's an idea I have been working on: If you purchase the Dell gift certificate, then place an order and pay for part of your order with your Visa card, then return the order, you will get credited the full purchase amount on your Visa.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Concierge Service, order pure gold for all your FPPs (when you have loads obviously) and bury it in your backyard.

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FYP

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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i'm thinking about taking the dell cards, scouting for smoking hot dell deals, and flipping on ebay...

thoughts?

there are people doing this on fatwallet all the time with cash

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That's likely the best way to deal with it, though I'm not sure how often the deals are just for Dell.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Here's an idea I have been working on: If you purchase the Dell gift certificate, then place an order and pay for part of your order with your Visa card, then return the order, you will get credited the full purchase amount on your Visa.

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this sounds like an interesting idea. Has anyone ever tried this before and can verify that it works?

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

Fish like prizes more than cash i suspect. a lot of fish don't care about the $$, but (for whatever reason) get their eyes on a prize and play till they get it.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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That's a good question: what is the point? I don't see how Stars is benefiting from the prizes, except maybe from people saving FPPs more, which seems like small potatoes to them, and fairly easily kept by putting the cash redeem at 50 or 100k points.

I suspect there's a legal issue somewhere.

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My guess is by giving merchandise stars can buy at wholesale and sell at retail. Effectively your 15% rakeback might only cost stars 10%

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YES

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Here's an idea I have been working on: If you purchase the Dell gift certificate, then place an order and pay for part of your order with your Visa card, then return the order, you will get credited the full purchase amount on your Visa.

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Umm...illegal. It will only work once at most.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Here's an idea I have been working on: If you purchase the Dell gift certificate, then place an order and pay for part of your order with your Visa card, then return the order, you will get credited the full purchase amount on your Visa.

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Umm...illegal. It will only work once at most.

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Illegal as in against the law? Why would this be against the law?

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Here's an idea I have been working on: If you purchase the Dell gift certificate, then place an order and pay for part of your order with your Visa card, then return the order, you will get credited the full purchase amount on your Visa.

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Umm...illegal. It will only work once at most.

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Illegal as in against the law? Why would this be against the law?

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It's fraud.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

no it's not. simply returning an item is well within the rules, it's up to them how they decide to credit you. What if someone did this unknowingly and got credited back on their visa? Would you support prosecuting them for fraud? Obviously you wouldn't.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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no it's not. simply returning an item is well within the rules, it's up to them how they decide to credit you. What if someone did this unknowingly and got credited back on their visa? Would you support prosecuting them for fraud? Obviously you wouldn't.

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Whatever do what you what.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

Why don't you just explain how it is legally fraud?

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

Not fraud in my State, and I work in the field. Don't know if it will work or not though.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Why don't you just explain how it is legally fraud?

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Nope. I don't feel like arguing about it. You want to do it good luck.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

because you are wrong.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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because you are wrong.

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You need another star troll.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

blah blah blah, I know you wanted to be right, but you simply aren't. Thanks for playing.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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blah blah blah, I know you wanted to be right, but you simply aren't. Thanks for playing.

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First person on my ignore list congrads.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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blah blah blah, I know you wanted to be right, but you simply aren't. Thanks for playing.

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First person on my ignore list congrads.

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I'd like to be your second.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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blah blah blah, I know you wanted to be right, but you simply aren't. Thanks for playing.

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First person on my ignore list congrads.

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I'd like to be your second.

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Nah. I plan on keeping it a select group. I can't just let anyone in or it would lose it prestige. You understand I hope.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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i'm thinking about taking the dell cards, scouting for smoking hot dell deals, and flipping on ebay...

thoughts?

there are people doing this on fatwallet all the time with cash

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That's likely the best way to deal with it, though I'm not sure how often the deals are just for Dell.

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You could probably just sell the Dell cards on ebay and make most of the $2k back.

Ok, I've done a little math. I play $15/30 or $20/40 and it looks like about 83% of all hands are raked for >= $1. 125,000 points are needed for a $2000 dell gift card. That works to around 150,000 hands to play. Now I will assume Supernova status which means you earn points at 3.5x the rate so now I need to play 43,000 hands for the $2000 gift card. My average rake per hand at PP 15/30 full is $.23. This means I would generate abut $10k in rake to earn a $2k gift card so about 20% rakeback minus how much I lose in the ebay sale (about $100 I'm guessing).

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Here's an idea I have been working on: If you purchase the Dell gift certificate, then place an order and pay for part of your order with your Visa card, then return the order, you will get credited the full purchase amount on your Visa.

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Minus shipping costs both ways [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

(... and they might just reactivate your gift card) LOL

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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This means I would generate abut $10k in rake to earn a $2k gift card so about 20% rakeback

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Wow.

Looks like you did the math correctly to me and 20% rakeback ain't half-bad.

Also consider that if you keep playing on you will get an even better percentage (it won't take another 43k hands to get your next dell certificate once you are already supernova).
So the more you play the higher your value gets...perhaps up to 25%-ish or so with lots of play.

Also the occasional reload bonus that I'm assuming they will still offer (although perhaps not).

And also the value of all those freeroll tourneys in there should you decide to take part in those (and possibly other deals and value that Stars gives along the way)

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

Bob,

it looks like obsidian is calculating all of this assuming supernova status already.

What I'd like to know is what the actual rake is for stars at various levels..

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Here's an idea I have been working on: If you purchase the Dell gift certificate, then place an order and pay for part of your order with your Visa card, then return the order, you will get credited the full purchase amount on your Visa.

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Not sure if its possible, but its certainly not fraud.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Bob,

it looks like obsidian is calculating all of this assuming supernova status already.

What I'd like to know is what the actual rake is for stars at various levels..

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Yes, this is correct. Some rakeback calculations for the other levels:

Bronze - 5.8%
Silver - 8.5%
Gold - 11.5%
Platinum - 14.5%

Yea, the rake and percent of hands that are raked at the various levels would let you find out the rakeback equivalent.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

okay...i see.

it's 20% once you already reach supernova.
So obviously is smaller on your way up there.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

These figures are not taking the weekly and monthly freerolls into consideration, right? IMO they will add significantly to those percentages, but the # of players is going to determine their true value and we don't have that info yet.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

nope...and we won't get that info UNTIL they actually have the freerolls.

the value of the freerolls is kind of iffy regardless and depends on your situation.

Some people don't like tourneys anyway.

Some people will find it difficult to make it to them.
For example, I'm guessing they might have them on Sundays which is a decent day for most people but is not as good for me.

If you can't make it or don't want the freerolls then obviously they don't add value for you.

And if you can make it there is no way to tell how much value there will be in them until we start playing them.

I suspect that even Stars doesn't have any idea.
They have a vague idea of how many people WOULD have made each level based on play this past year....but that doesn't really mean too much because they don't know how many people will go from zero ring-game play at Stars to full-time ring-game play at Stars just because of the VIP club.


Right now it looks like quite a few 2+2'ers will be giving this a try.
This does not bode terribly well for game-selection there either UNLESS this club hopefully attracts a lot more fish to play there as well. One can only hope.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Yea, the rake and percent of hands that are raked at the various levels would let you find out the rakeback equivalent.

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what I mean is a direct party -> stars comparison just based on rakeback calculations isn't enough. the bottom line is going to be your net rake - after calculating in rakeback and/or other promos.

if stars rake is 2bb/100 with 10% rb it's better than party if it rakes 2.5bb/100 with 20% rb. know what I mean ?

(yes i realize these numbers aren't accurate)

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

>UNLESS this club hopefully attracts a lot more fish to >play there as well. One can only hope.

Seeing Porsche might do the trick...

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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Yea, the rake and percent of hands that are raked at the various levels would let you find out the rakeback equivalent.

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what I mean is a direct party -> stars comparison just based on rakeback calculations isn't enough. the bottom line is going to be your net rake - after calculating in rakeback and/or other promos.

if stars rake is 2bb/100 with 10% rb it's better than party if it rakes 2.5bb/100 with 20% rb. know what I mean ?

(yes i realize these numbers aren't accurate)

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True, but I am just assuming that at the level I play they are going to be similiar.

Re: Stars VIP = Cash???
 

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This does not bode terribly well for game-selection there either UNLESS this club hopefully attracts a lot more fish to play there as well. One can only hope.


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1. A lot of 2+2ers have leaks and are beatable, mostly from playing a bit too weak-tight after the flop.
2. This program is likely to push Stars upwards of 70K players. They will not all be good.
3. This program will likely attract some fish as well as some TAGS. And now that the bonus whores have almost nowhere to go, we are sure to see them at the tables as well.
4. And maybe most important: I'm assuming a nice number of players will be flocking to Stars from some of the smaller sites. As games are harder to find at these places (i.e. UB and FullTilt) the remaining players will need to find a game somewhere!