Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

What do you think? I know not to call three cold on the flop. Was this play more Ed Miller or Lee Jones? All comments are appreciated.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="666666">2 folds</font>, CO calls, Hero calls, SB completes, BB checks,

Flop: (5 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">BB raises</font>, UTG+1 folds, <font color="CC3333">CO 3-bets</font>, Hero folds, SB calls, BB calls.

Turn: (7 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">CO raises</font>, SB calls, BB calls.

River: (13 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="CC3333">CO bets</font>, SB calls, BB calls.

Final Pot: 16 BB
<font color="green">Main Pot: 16 BB, between SB, BB and CO.</font>

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

I think you made the right play here. With a bet and TWO raises in front of you, you have to assume someone has flopped a flush, unless you are at a table full of loose and aggressive players. At this point you have very little invested in the pot. It's always tough to laydown a set, but here I think you have to get out and save your money.

That being said, it wouldn't be a terrible move to cap it here because even if someone does have a flush, you still have 7 outs to make a full house or quads. And it's possible that you are up against naked A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] and two pair or something like that. It all depends on your style of play and your read on the other players. Personally, I would do exactly what you did.

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

This fold is HORRIBLE. Even if you do not have the best hand, you will make a boat or quads more than 30% of the time, and will get paid off shitloads when you do. You should be capping for value, not folding.

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

Pardon me for being harsh, but if anyone is capable of a fold on the flop here for any amount, you need to give up the game.

You've got 10 outs twice to what should be the best hand. You might even have the best hand now, and are caught in a war with two players who are vastly overplaying their hands. You're about a 1.5-1 underdog to improve by the river. Your implied odds are gonzo here. Things will likely slow down on the turn. Only a stone cold fool would fold here.

If someone has TT, dems the breaks. You're going to pay him off. And I don't care what the final result was, this was a brainless fold. Neither Miller nor Jones would associate himself with it in any fashion whatsoever.

Go ahead and cap the flop. You may be behind, but against two other players, you'll improve more than enough to make up for that extra SB you're putting out on the flop. Call anything on the turn, and if the action is to you on the river and it's one bet for a showdown, you're calling that, too.

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

Nate said it, you should read it.

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

Good to see someone actually make a "big laydown" on these boards. Instead, everyone is always raising and reraising with hands that don't seem to deserve it. You flopped a pretty big hand here with your set of 4s, but with all that action one of them has to have a flush (and if not at least a good draw) so you are almost certainly behind. You're going to lose this hand more often than you win, so time to get out while the getting is cheep right.

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

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You're going to lose this hand more often than you win, so time to get out while the getting is cheep right.

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And when you win this unexpected hand then you will probably win more bets than you ever lost by folding this hand. Be agressive - CAP THE FLOP! And speaking of agressiveness, you should have raised PF. It will eaither build the pot for your eventual win, or shake out that suited player who just might beat you with a flush.

In da club [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

oh yeah i guess i forgot the [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

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You've got 10 outs twice to what should be the best hand .... You're about a 1.5-1 underdog to improve by the river.

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I'm sure you just 'miss-spoke', but he's not 1.5:1 against... more like 2:1. He's got 7 outs on the flop and 10 on the turn - 36.67% from 1/6.7 + 1/4.6.

Re: Flopped set on a suited flop: Cap of fold?
 

This is interesting: posters I respect on both sides of the issue. Despite this (and I will throw my opinion in for what it's worth), this fold seems to me to be a very very very large error. If you are behind to a flush you have seven outs on the turn, and ten on the river. If you are behind to a set of tens... thems the breaks.

The only real debate I see is whether or not to cap the flop. I initially (intuitively) thought just call. However, giving it some thought (which in fairness you don't have a whole lot of time to mull these things over in the heat of the moment) capping for value might be wise, and it strikes every fiber of my poker being as a sin to cold call 3 bets.