Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there?
 

I'm at a greasy spoon, and I see a poster about a local girl with leukemia who's on chemo and she's upset because her parents work instead of spending time with her at the hospital. The poster asks for donations so that her parents can stay at the hospital with her.

I can understand the girl being upset that her parents work.

One of the pictures shows her holding a balloon or something like that. In the background is the tail of a minivan. She's 4.

But here's what bothers me about the poster:

I see her in front of a minivan that doesn't look totally run down (at least, the tail end of it), and I ask myself...

"Have her parents sold the car?"

"Have they sold the house?"

"Have they quit one of their jobs, to work a night job, so that they can take shifts with her?"

etc.

I mean, if someone wrote a poster and it said, "Hi. I have a sick kid, and I'd love to spend time in the hospital with her, but I don't want to sell my house." Would you help out?

I mean, if they said, "If I were to sell my car and buy a cheaper car, I'd lose like $3000 on the deal." I'd ask them what was more important, the money or the girl...

I would help them if they were a friend, but if they're a stranger, it kinda feels like you're being a sucker by helping them.

Obviously, I don't know the whole story, but these are my initial impressions.

Anyone have any comments?
--Dave.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

The treatment for childhood Leukemia is probably not very cheap, and it is kind of depressing to be around a kid that you know will die sooner than you will.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

true. they should sell the car, house, and quit their full time jobs.
then when the daughter gets better, she can make a sign that says "my parents sold their car, house, and quit their jobs to spend time with me when i was on chemo in the hospital. donations for a new house and car would be cool. they also need jobs, and are available for interview."
you don't even want to know what the sign reads if she dies.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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The treatment for childhood Leukemia is probably not very cheap,

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I was thinking about this.

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and it is kind of depressing to be around a kid that you know will die sooner than you will.

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The parents want to be there.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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true. they should sell the car, house, and quit their full time jobs.
then when the daughter gets better, she can make a sign that says "my parents sold their car, house, and quit their jobs to spend time with me when i was on chemo in the hospital. donations for a new house and car would be cool. they also need jobs, and are available for interview."
you don't even want to know what the sign reads if she dies.

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I'm of the opinion that three people living in an apartment with a crappy car isn't some definition of hell or anything.

Neither is two people living in an apartment.

Keep in mind that the poster is asking for cash in order to get hours off work: so they're not losing their jobs over this (unless they quit one for the shift thing, like I suggested would be a possibility).

Edit: What I mean to say here is that while it sucks to lose a daughter, it doesn't really matter if you lose a house, a car, or whatever in the same stroke. It's just a house.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

Suppose that the only way that they can afford to pay for their kid's treatement is with the insurance that they get from their job, so they have to work, otherwise they can't afford the treatment. Perhaps the jobs they have are such that they need to car, or that the house they live in is already the only affordable housing near their work.

Also, my understanding is that childhood cancer treatment is so incredibly expensive that even if they were to sell their home and car, it wouldn't make much of a dent as far as the total cost of care would eventually be.

Now granted, I don't know the full story either, and I'm saying that this is only a small possible set of circumstances that could prevent them from spending more time at the hospital, but I'm not the one who's making assumptions to make a couple of parents whose daughter is dying of cancer out to be deadbeat scam artists.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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Suppose that the only way that they can afford to pay for their kid's treatement is with the insurance that they get from their job, so they have to work, otherwise they can't afford the treatment. Perhaps the jobs they have are such that they need to car, or that the house they live in is already the only affordable housing near their work.

Also, my understanding is that childhood cancer treatment is so incredibly expensive that even if they were to sell their home and car, it wouldn't make much of a dent as far as the total cost of care would eventually be.

Now granted, I don't know the full story either, and I'm saying that this is only a small possible set of circumstances that could prevent them from spending more time at the hospital, but I'm not the one who's making assumptions to make a couple of parents whose daughter is dying of cancer out to be deadbeat scam artists.

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That sounds like a bingo.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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Suppose that the only way that they can afford to pay for their kid's treatement is with the insurance that they get from their job, so they have to work, otherwise they can't afford the treatment.

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Firstly, this is smart. Thanks. (Keep in mind that I did say that I didn't know the whole story.)

But for some reason you guys are missing the idea that they're looking for cash so that they can afford to take time off work...

... so they're not losing their jobs, and they don't need to work if they have cash.

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Also, my understanding is that childhood cancer treatment is so incredibly expensive that even if they were to sell their home and car, it wouldn't make much of a dent as far as the total cost of care would eventually be.


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This is really really possible. I'm Canadian, so it's probably not as bad as if this were in the states, but I have no idea to be honest.

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Now granted, I don't know the full story either, and I'm saying that this is only a small possible set of circumstances that could prevent them from spending more time at the hospital, but I'm not the one who's making assumptions to make a couple of parents whose daughter is dying of cancer out to be deadbeat scam artists.

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Um... No. I said that I'd "feel" like a sucker (not be one). I said that I don't know the whole story. Maybe the parameters that you're throwing out here have been met. Maybe it's really expensive. I don't know and I'm really glad I've never had to experience anything like this. I really really hate the idea of this girl being sick, too. That part really sucks.

I understand that this is a hard thing to go through. But, I'm curious about what is really being done through donating to them. On one side, there's the aspect of showing compassion. It doesn't really matter if you are helping too much or not. It's just nice to know that people care. In a sense, it's a good thing to donate even if it doesn't make a dent, because it makes them feel better.

... But here's the thing that's nagging at me, basically the only thing: If they have a positive net worth after coming out of this, then what's being done as a result of donation is essentially helping them buy whatever is included in their net worth at the end of the ordeal, right?

I mean, if you gave them 10 grand, and at the end, they had spent time with their daughter, but owned a car worth 10 grand, wouldn't you have just bought them a car, rather than their time at the hospital? And keep in mind I'm not just talking about a car, which could be seen as something helpful to them working. What about their house? What about their RRSPs (retirement savings plan) if they have any of that left, etc. Basically, I'm not 100% sure that they actually need help, even though I know they're going through hard times.

(fwiw I'm pretty sure apartments have a lower monthly expense than a house, pretty much no matter where you go, but I could be wrong about that... some possibility exists, though, that they need to keep ownership of the house in order to leverage its equity to pay for medical bills.)

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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I'm at a greasy spoon, and I see a poster about a local girl with leukemia who's on chemo and she's upset because her parents work instead of spending time with her at the hospital. The poster asks for donations so that her parents can stay at the hospital with her.

I can understand the girl being upset that her parents work.

One of the pictures shows her holding a balloon or something like that. In the background is the tail of a minivan. She's 4.

But here's what bothers me about the poster:

I see her in front of a minivan that doesn't look totally run down (at least, the tail end of it), and I ask myself...

"Have her parents sold the car?"

"Have they sold the house?"

"Have they quit one of their jobs, to work a night job, so that they can take shifts with her?"

etc.

I mean, if someone wrote a poster and it said, "Hi. I have a sick kid, and I'd love to spend time in the hospital with her, but I don't want to sell my house." Would you help out?

I mean, if they said, "If I were to sell my car and buy a cheaper car, I'd lose like $3000 on the deal." I'd ask them what was more important, the money or the girl...

I would help them if they were a friend, but if they're a stranger, it kinda feels like you're being a sucker by helping them.

Obviously, I don't know the whole story, but these are my initial impressions.

Anyone have any comments?
--Dave.

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I haven't read the other comments, but her parents could probably sell everything they own and not even put a dent in the medical bills.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there?
 

So they sell everything and then there homeless. Would that the motivation for you to give?

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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The treatment for childhood Leukemia is probably not very cheap, and it is kind of depressing to be around a kid that you know will die sooner than you will.

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Exactly. So why should the parents go and get themselves all broke and depressed over some stupid kid? They should stop paying for her chemo and go on with their lives and forget about her.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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The treatment for childhood Leukemia is probably not very cheap, and it is kind of depressing to be around a kid that you know will die sooner than you will.

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Exactly. So why should the parents go and get themselves all broke and depressed over some stupid kid? They should stop paying for her chemo and go on with their lives and forget about her.

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Well, suppose that they have other children? Even though they have the sick daughter, they still have to interests of the other child/ren to attend to.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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The treatment for childhood Leukemia is probably not very cheap, and it is kind of depressing to be around a kid that you know will die sooner than you will.

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Exactly. So why should the parents go and get themselves all broke and depressed over some stupid kid? They should stop paying for her chemo and go on with their lives and forget about her.

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Well, suppose that they have other children? Even though they have the sick daughter, they still have to interests of the other child/ren to attend to.

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All the more reason to cut ties with the sick one. Survival of the fittest and all that.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there?
 

Maybe they work for insurance? If they work at the same place then there is probably a huge family plan discount. And with a new job or no job the condition is pre-existing and there will be no coverage.

I dunno, tell the kid to suck it up and give 'em 20

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

Boy did I think this was a strange coincidence until I saw who the poster was. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Yeah, I thought the same thing when I saw it. Sad situation, and we really don't know what the circumstances are, but I had the same thoughts...

Edit: There is no charge for chemo-therapy in Canada as far as I know. It is covered by our health insurance. My Grandfather had many years in and our of the hospital with cancer before he died. There is no charge unless she is being taken to a private facility, which is possible.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

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Boy did I think this was a strange coincidence until I saw who the poster was. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Yeah, I thought the same thing when I saw it. Sad situation, and we really don't know what the circumstances are, but I had the same thoughts...

Edit: There is no charge for chemo-therapy in Canada as far as I know. It is covered by our health insurance. My Grandfather had many years in and our of the hospital with cancer before he died. There is no charge unless she is being taken to a private facility, which is possible.



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To be completely honest, this is where my nitdom goes from being just irritating, to being downright disturbing. I wish I weren't this cynical.

I guess my main points are that even if they have another child, moving to an apartment to pay for medical stuff seems like a reasonable idea. And the people that respond to this post are completely ignorant to the request for cash in order to get time off work (which is in the OP). Even if one of them took a leave of absense from their present job and took a night job for cash, they would likely still be covered under their current group insurance, based on the premise that the poster itself is based on.

So, it boils down to: will they have a positive net worth, and what will it be, when they're done? Will they have enough cash for an apartment, or will they be homeless.

If it's a matter of them being homeless, then the poster should read something like: sick kid, need to take time off work, don't want to be homeless, which is a reasonable request.

If they'll have an apartment and a car, it should read: sick kid, don't want to have to sell house, which is a reasonable request, but something that i would be more inclined to help a friend with than a stranger.

The key becomes evaluating different charities:

You'd have to decide between giving to someone who has a sick kid and doesn't want to live in an apartment vs giving money to (for example) kids in africa, who's poster would read: need money, don't want to starve. or something like that.

In the case of "sick kid, don't want to live in an apartment" vs. "need cash, don't want to starve", I think we know who NEEDS the money vs who WANTS the money.

Furthermore, if it were the case that these parents were making the decision to work rather than move into an apartment when their daughter is having chemo, I'd be pretty furious with them. I'll reiterate my earlier point: It's just a house.

There's two other factors that come into play here:

1) I don't know what the situation is with the family of the girl on the poster: maybe it's a matter of preventing them from becoming homeless. That would essentially equal the two charities in my books.

1.5) If they don't have savings, I'm curious as to why they don't. I had some brief thoughts about how responsible they'd been with their finances before this point but came to two conclusions:

1.5 A) This is a "sunk cost" scenario and doesn't matter in the evaluation of what to do NOW.

1.5 B) This is not the fault of the daughter.

2) They're local, presumably? I don't know. It appears that way. If you do a search on google you'll find the poster, but there's no information on who it's for (even general information other than the situation). For all I know, these guys could live anywhere in Ontario or possibly the northern states).

Contributing to local charities has a positive effect on yourself and your children/grandchildren that's greater than that of making a donation to a foreign charity (most of the time*). You could even say that making a donation to a foreign charity would have a detrimental effect on yourself/children/grandchildren (most of the time).

*By most of the time, I mean excepting cases where making donations to foreign charities prevents terrorism, etc.

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I just want to make a point here that I don't like the idea of children being ill and I don't like human suffering in general. I'm not trying to be an a-hole, but I'm trying to carefully think about this situation. In fact, it doesn't really matter for this particular situation as much as it's important for evaluating future charitable situations, for me.

If anything, this situation has gotten me thinking about lonely sick children in hospitals. It might be cool to volunteer to go read to them or something, just keeping them company... as poker pros, this is possible due to the flexible hours our jobs afford.

I'd like to bring up the point one more time that it's probably "unhealthy" to be cynical regarding these situations, but I'm kinda stuck being the way I am.

Re: Sick girl wants her parents at the hospital, why aren\'t they there
 

What depressed me was that the sign implied that the parents weren't being there. That blows... really. Even if it's a homeless situation.