lmd taught me this
 

9/18 Commerce full table. Three limpers to me in the SB, I complete with A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. BB checks and we go five ways to the flop.

FLOP: J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]10 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Checked around.

TURN: 8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Checked to button who bets. I check-raise...

Re: lmd taught me this
 

I'm inclined to raise this preflop. I don't dig the turn c/r as I'm not quite sure what you're trying to accomplish, since you're representing bascially nothing with your c/r.

Rob

Re: lmd taught me this
 

explain.

Re: lmd taught me this
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'm inclined to raise this preflop. I don't dig the turn c/r as I'm not quite sure what you're trying to accomplish, since you're representing bascially nothing with your c/r.

Rob

[/ QUOTE ]

The idea with the river checkraise is easy: the river seems very unlikely to have helped button into a made hand, so he's probably on a draw. By checkraising his draw, OP wins the pot both when he hits his draw on the river, and when the button misses his. This doesn't always work and ceretainly isn't my default line, but it's certainly defensible.

I have never raised this preflop in my life, but maybe I'm missing the boat here. Care to elaborate?
jvs

Re: lmd taught me this
 

read the initial post again.

Re: lmd taught me this
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm inclined to raise this preflop. I don't dig the turn c/r as I'm not quite sure what you're trying to accomplish, since you're representing bascially nothing with your c/r.

Rob

[/ QUOTE ]

The idea with the river checkraise is easy: the river seems very unlikely to have helped button into a made hand, so he's probably on a draw. By checkraising his draw, OP wins the pot both when he hits his draw on the river, and when the button misses his. This doesn't always work and ceretainly isn't my default line, but it's certainly defensible.

I have never raised this preflop in my life, but maybe I'm missing the boat here. Care to elaborate?
jvs

[/ QUOTE ]

So exactly how are we folding out better hands here? Or is there some way we're getting worse hands to call?

Rob

Re: lmd taught me this
 

[ QUOTE ]

So exactly how are we folding out better hands here? Or is there some way we're getting worse hands to call?

Rob

[/ QUOTE ]

You are getting HU vs. a player who is, in estimated order of likelihood:

a) on a draw & likely cannot call a river bet unless he makes his hand

b) is on absolute air & is trying to steal a pot no one has taken any interest in

c) has a weak made hand that may not be able to call.

d) has a made straight/slowplayed set and is destroying you

The play seems fine to me most of the time. I could be wrong though.

jvs

Re: lmd taught me this
 

[ QUOTE ]
explain.

[/ QUOTE ]
I would very much like everyone to fold.

Re: lmd taught me this
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
explain.

[/ QUOTE ]
I would very much like everyone to fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

But assuming all but button fold, and river blanks off, do you bring the heat again? The good news is that your draw likely highcards all other possible pure draws.

jvs

Re: lmd taught me this
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
explain.

[/ QUOTE ]
I would very much like everyone to fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why not bet? I think the chances of everyone folding are relatively just as good (it's not like the pot is big or anything) and the parlay that you're hoping for here -- a late position bet from a hand that either can't call a raise or is a draw that will fold to river bet -- is quite high given the pot size.

Rob