Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

Has there been a change to the way Absolute calculates MGR? I know the general consensus is that bonuses do not effect their MGR, but when I check my stats from my affiliate every day is about $50 less than the Total Rake / Average Players Per Hand. I'm also clearing about $50 worth of bonuses a day.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

from what i know they do not subtract bonuses from MGR. however, about 2 or so months ago a few affiliates were complaining that the way they calculate MGR is very 'screwy'.

-ryan

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

Make sure you are using the latest pokertracker patch [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

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Make sure you are using the latest pokertracker patch [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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Yeah, I fixed that problem. Things are still screwy for me.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

Pokertracker shows my MGR on Absolute as $500, Absolute tells my associate it's only $110.

So I'm in the same boat as you are.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

poppa,

It may just be that absolute is slow in getting updated data to your affiliate. Not all sites provide daily updates.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

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It may just be that absolute is slow in getting updated data to your affiliate. Not all sites provide daily updates.

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Absolute provides daily updates.

My first-ever hands were played evening of 10/17. I had positive MGR in the 10/18 report to my affiliate. I continued to play and each daily report since then has shown additional MGR on my account.

Does anyone know the cutoff time that a hand must be played by to be reported the next day? Absolute is on Eastern time.

I have the PT patch for Absolute returned bets and there are no bad hands in my DB. My reported MGR seems way too low and I am unable to get even close to reconciling it with my PT stats.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

Is there a possibility your affiliate is ripping you off?

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

From what I've read in another forum it seems that Absolute does a poor job of staying on top of it's MGR and rakeback statistics and paying when due. It seems that every month either the affiliate or the players are E-mailing Absolute to insure proper and speedy payments.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

I haven't played there in a week, and the reported MGR has never caught up.

I don't plan on going back unless they fix this, as it's a tough site only made worthwhile by rakeback and bonuses.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

Well, I'm glad (somewhat) to see that I'm not alone. However, I wish an affiliate would be able to offer more information.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

What if, in an effort to clean up their accounting, they decided to subtract bonuses from MGR?

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

I havent verified stats with PT, but absolute mgr numbers seem low to me also.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

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I havent verified stats with PT, but absolute mgr numbers seem low to me also.

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yeah mine as well, like less than half

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

[ QUOTE ]
from what i know they do not subtract bonuses from MGR. however, about 2 or so months ago a few affiliates were complaining that the way they calculate MGR is very 'screwy'.

-ryan

[/ QUOTE ]


Exactly how do they calculate MGR? Or claim to...

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

There have been a total of 4 pokertracker patches this month to deal with changes Absolute has made to their hand histories.

Make sure you are running 2.08.03D

This was specifically noted in regard to the last patch, but if you were not keeping up with all the patches, you may need to do this starting from an earlier date...

[ QUOTE ]
FIX - On Oct. 18, Absolute had another format change where they started including "Player X - returned $NN : not called" in their new hand histories. PT was not accounting for this line so it was causing incorrect data to be loaded. Amounts won and lost were wrong along with the pot size and rake amounts.

To correct these bad hands, use the Utilities/Export Hand Histories To File window to export all the hands played since Oct. 18, 2005 to text files. Then go to the Utilities/Database Maintenance and Options window and delete all your sessions played since (and including) Oct. 18. Then reimport the files you exported in the first step using the File/Import Hand Histories/Tournament Summaries window, Select Files To Import button.


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Its also worth noting that these patches are still considered beta and there may be other issues that haven't been identified and corrected.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

thanks sniper...I didn't realize I had to go back and export and reload

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

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Exactly how do they calculate MGR? Or claim to...

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Their affiliate page says it is the total rake divided by the number of seated players. I assume they intended that to mean players dealt cards and not include sitouts.

There are several standard deductions for chargebacks, etc. but no deduction for bonuses.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

I am also seeing discrepancies between my expected MGR and the actual one my affiliate reports to me. After playing over 6000 hands there my affiliate says that their absolute stats show only 2000.

Absolute has a stats tab in their software which also shows that I've played much more than 2000 hands. I guess they do subtract bonuses from MGR in some way. It is either this or they are ripping their affiliates off (my affiliate is a respected one).

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

I asked Absolute support how I could poaaibly have earned 2600 Absolute points playing $2/4 and $3/6 while only contributing $110 in rake.

No response yet.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

I've played 8000 hands of 5/10 and 10/20 6-max at absolute this month. According to PT my rake contributed is $3500. My affiliate is reporting my MGR as $1500. I've cleared about $500 in bonuses. I am almost certain my affiliate isn't lying. This looks to be of concern.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

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I haven't played there in a week, and the reported MGR has never caught up.

I don't plan on going back unless they fix this, as it's a tough site only made worthwhile by rakeback and bonuses.

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I have a theory on this. Because my MGR is lower than I think it should be.

I think that for MGR they are only taking hands where you contribute to the pot.

While for bonuses it is any raked hand.

This is the only way it makes sense to me. Because I have a UB account where I get the same rate, I play an almost equal number of hands on each and my UB MGR is almost 50% higher than my Absolute MGR.

EDIT: My affliate is as solid as they come. No way he is jerking me.

What is actually happening
 

I have carefully compared the Absolute MGR numbers reported by my affiliate with Poker Tracker. At first the reported numbers did not seem to make any sense but now I am convinced I know what is happening:

1. The daily report is based on hands played from midnight-to-midnight the previous day. This is based on site time which is U.S. Eastern time.

2. MGR is based on total rake divided by number of players receiving cards, just like Party.

3. Bonuses do not affect MGR.

4. The computed MGR numbers are divided by two [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img].

I figured this out because of a day where I played very few hands and had a very small MGR. I then went pot-by-pot and computed MGR based on number of players at the table etc. The rules described above seem to be the only possible explanation for that daily result.

I then went over another day's results pot-by-pot using these rules and the result exactly matched the reported value.

That was as much pot-by-pot computation as I wanted to do because it is a lot of work. But I approximated all my other daily results using total rake and the average number of players at my tables. I reproduced all of my daily results within a few percent. I'm pretty certain I've got it right.

Re: What is actually happening
 

Great work as usual.

That seems like pretty shady business to not announce the fact that everyone's MGR is cut in half all the time, no?

Re: What is actually happening
 

Stellar, you should email taht to absolute and see what they have to say, then fill us in.

Maybe even link them to the thtead, so they know its not just you who is converned.

Re: What is actually happening
 

Seriously, thanks for doing this work. I am also interested in finding out what Absolute has to say.

Re: What is actually happening
 

This is very accurate based on my observations...

I have played the same number of hands so far this month (a little more) as I did all of last month. My MGR is slightly less than half of what I got last month.....


hmmmmmmmmm..........

Margon

Re: What is actually happening
 

probably some exec trying to save a few $$$
you'd think if they were going to scam everyone, they would report something like 80-90% of the real MGR. so no one could have any definitive proof without tons of work.
even if they fix this, i hope all of you demand that extra MGR before you play any more hands

Re: What is actually happening
 

My mgr is also lower than it should be. The divided by 2 thing seems about right. Thanks for doing the work StellarWind. Hopefully Absolute can get back to us on this. Why they would do this, without telling us or the affiliates is beyond me, not cool.

Re: What is actually happening
 

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Stellar, you should email taht to absolute and see what they have to say, then fill us in.

Maybe even link them to the thtead, so they know its not just you who is converned.

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I've notified my affiliate. I trust him to take care of this. I'm just a player and AP doesn't owe me an explanation about affiliate payments.

My personal opinion is someone made a mistake with the software. I don't think there is intent to cheat anyone. It isn't time to pay for this month's play so they haven't done anything wrong yet except distribute an erroneous data feed.

Maybe they already know about the problem and are working on fixing it. Maybe the business people haven't seen to monthly numbers yet and don't realize they are low.

The recent bonuses were very generous. I will continue to play while this is resolved. This is not a perfect site but they have a decent attitude toward their customers and they are trying to improve their product. Compared to the stagnant decay at Paradise and the arrogance of Party that's a welcome change.

Re: What is actually happening
 

yeah...i'm playing there still too, because my bonus collected is greater than my rake at 1/2 6max

Re: What is actually happening
 

My PT calculated MGR is also twice my affiliate's reported numbers.

Thanks for figuring it out. Hopefully AP will fix it.

Re: What is actually happening
 

3rd-ing this..pokergrapher's stats say my MGR is about twice what's reported

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

Apparently, the absolute poker room manager responded in a different thread here saying that the rake structure hasn't changed. however, he didn't address the MGR problem.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

I am looking into this right now. Due to the nature of the issue, I suspect it will take at least until tomorrow before I have some answers.

Richard Frost
Assistant Poker Room Manager
Absolute Poker
prm@absolutepoker.com

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

[ QUOTE ]
I am looking into this right now. Due to the nature of the issue, I suspect it will take at least until tomorrow before I have some answers.

Richard Frost
Assistant Poker Room Manager
Absolute Poker
prm@absolutepoker.com

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey,

Around here we like out Poker Room representatives to be rude, uniformative and oblivious... we also want them to say "ENJOY".

Seriously, thank you for looking into this. I for one have played 3-times the hands this month than I did last. I enjoy your site and feel I have found a new home. I trust this matter will be explained or handled in the professional manner that you guys always handle things.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

Agreed. I always think it looks good when a site rep chimes in about something that is clearly a major concern to the forum.

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

I think the bonus is now affecting MGR. PokerTracker shows that my rake yesterday was $86.25. I cleared $60 in bonus. My affiliate (who I have no reason not to trust) shows my MGR for yesterday as $27.

I wonder if they changed this policy and just didn't tell the affiliates.

SevenFooter

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

My pokertracker only shows rake on pots that I have won which means it would be different to how most sites calculate it. Is there a way that I can set it up to use tablerake/number of players as rake paid?

Re: Effect of Bonuses on Absolute MGR
 

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My pokertracker only shows rake on pots that I have won which means it would be different to how most sites calculate it. Is there a way that I can set it up to use tablerake/number of players as rake paid?

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Summary Tab gives you # of Raked Hands, Average Rake, and Average # of Players.