Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Decided to join the fun at 20/40, at least when the games are good. They were good tonight but I got shelled. Such is poker. What is the best river play? Oh, and I know this is a full table but honestly I'm a HUSH hermit and hey, the river decision is still a shorthanded decision. Comments also welcome on the weird flop play.

Both opponents are bad. UTG is BRADY2020 and CO is CBROWNS1 if that helps anyone. Only reads on them are their numbers, both in the 50/20ish range. CBROWNS is definitely more on the aggro side postflop and BRADY more on the passive side, but don't know much else.

Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, Hero calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, CO calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero calls, MP1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, SB folds, BB folds, <font color="#CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero caps</font>, MP1 folds, CO calls, UTG calls.

Turn: (9.50 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero calls, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, UTG calls, Hero calls.

River: (15.50 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
UTG checks, Hero does what planning to what?

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

I bet the river here.

i) You put at most 2 bets in on the river
ii) You put at least 1 in
iii) CO might not bet a scared set/2 pair, but will call.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

I think I like check calling. You have the bottom end of the straight against two guys who play 50% of their hands.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

What if UTG check raises here? You get stuck paying 3 bets or folding.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

What if UTG check raises here? You get stuck paying 3 bets or folding.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

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Hero does what planning to what?

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I bet planning on throwing up when I pay off a raise because one of them somehow produces a 7.

Cartman

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

nm

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

75 fits CO's play very well..much better than any other hand besides maybe Jacks up. This was a big worry for me when I was trying to figure out what to do.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Bet.

Oh yeah, fold pre flop.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Bet/call (pot is too big to fold) I wouldnt expect there to be a 7 with that much flop action.

If someone has 75 so be it but I'd expect to see some trash 2 pair or a set.

Oh yeah and WTF were you thinking with that preflop limp in early position.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
Bet/call (pot is too big to fold) I wouldnt expect there to be a 7 with that much flop action.

If someone has 75 so be it but I'd expect to see some trash 2 pair or a set.


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This is contradictory. If they are playing trash that leads to two pairs on this raggy board with that much preflop action what is to stop them from playing trash containing a 7. Or specifically 57(it fits the turn raise well). Not to mention 77 might go this route.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Loose/Agros arent loose/stupid postflop. Most are only moderately bad postflop, at 20/40 they dont just spew chips with nothing (some rare ones do).

Being scared of a 7 here is just weak, if the guy has 75 so be it but the times he doesnt you collect a couple of bets instead of zero which is highly likely when he sees the 4 straight.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
Oh yeah, fold pre flop.

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Okay, still getting readjusted to full ring early position play. I'd been folding the low Axs if a tight player limped in front of me but overlimping after a bad player, especially when there were more loose players behind me. How low would you go with Axs in this spot?

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

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What if UTG check raises here? You get stuck paying 3 bets or folding.

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If UTG check 3 bets here we can muck with more certainty that if he had simply check/raised (after we checked river).

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Anyone have any guesses as to the EV of a bet/call versus a check/call? It sounds like bet/fold is not an option for anyone.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Doing that stuff with medium suited connectors, low PPs and Axs stuff is ok in low limit games or extremely passive games but not here.

Save that stuff for CO or the button.

I might limp there with A9s if I was feeling frisky but normally I'd just raise ATs and go from there.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Dane,

If the table is playing like a $2/$4 table, then A2s is an okay limp here. In general, I'm limping A9s-A8s and raising ATs+ behind a very loose player like the one you describe.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
Dane,

If the table is playing like a $2/$4 table, then A2s is an okay limp here. In general, I'm limping A9s-A8s and raising ATs+ behind a very loose player like the one you describe.

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im looking at the SH starting chart, it says to raise A8s and A9s from any position


is the limp really that bad?

the SH starting chart also says to limp with any suited ace.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (10 handed)

He just loves HUSH more than MidHigh

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Dane,

If the table is playing like a $2/$4 table, then A2s is an okay limp here. In general, I'm limping A9s-A8s and raising ATs+ behind a very loose player like the one you describe.

[/ QUOTE ]

im looking at the SH starting chart, it says to raise A8s and A9s from any position


is the limp really that bad?

the SH starting chart also says to limp with any suited ace.

[/ QUOTE ]THIS IS A RING GAME.
you really se a chart? and you admit this?

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker 20/40 Hold'em (10 handed)

He just loves HUSH more than MidHigh

[/ QUOTE ]

There should be a "Recovering HUSHer" forum.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

PF is a fold for me... i think thats a really thin play.
river id prob checkraise/fold but bet/calling is also ok.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
Bet.

Oh yeah, fold pre flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly.

blake

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

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PF is a fold for me... i think thats a really thin play.

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A5s is thin. A2s is anorexic.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

LEAVE ME ALONE I'M USED TO 6-MAX!! YOU'RE LUCKY I DIDN'T RAISE!!

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
PF is a fold for me... i think thats a really thin play.

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A5s is thin. A2s is anorexic.

[/ QUOTE ]


is there really that big a difference between a pair of fives and a pair of deuces?

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

I gotta take the dog out will think about it during the walk- my initial reaction is to check raise the aggro guy.

Limping here isn't terrible, but these guys are going to limp with every ace behind you so you will be dominated a lot. I perfer to limp with hands like this when your opponents are more passive post flop as you don't get charged as heavy on the draws and can get away from your dominated aces easier.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Bet/call (pot is too big to fold) I wouldnt expect there to be a 7 with that much flop action.

If someone has 75 so be it but I'd expect to see some trash 2 pair or a set.


[/ QUOTE ]

This is contradictory. If they are playing trash that leads to two pairs on this raggy board with that much preflop action what is to stop them from playing trash containing a 7. Or specifically 57(it fits the turn raise well). Not to mention 77 might go this route.

[/ QUOTE ]

Its not contradictory- there is really only one hand for villian to have that contains a 7 that he plays this way, but there are tons of hands that include two pair and sets as well as donkoed big PPs that poor players love to slowplay.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

I think checking is the way to go here- you nearly always get a bet from an aggro player. I would fold if its two bets back to me from a c/r. I think i c/r myself if UTG calls the first bet and just check call if he folds.

I think you have to fold to a three bet if you check raise.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
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PF is a fold for me... i think thats a really thin play.

[/ QUOTE ]

A5s is thin. A2s is anorexic.

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is there really that big a difference between a pair of fives and a pair of deuces?

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Looks like it here:

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/9617/a2a55ck.png

Hey, what happened to you avatar? I miss those things.

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

[ QUOTE ]
LEAVE ME ALONE I'M USED TO 6-MAX!! YOU'RE LUCKY I DIDN'T RAISE!!

[/ QUOTE ]

lol

Re: Welcome to 20/40, BITCH!
 

Yeah...so I bet/folded and I would have won. Don't know what I was thinking. Just had him pegged on 75 when he raised again. UTG called two and won with QJ. I think CO had A4o.




/Pulls trigger