20/40 Hand
 

This hand was a month ago.
8 handed.
UTG is pretty tight-agg
MP is a bit on the loose side (his limp in this hand means any suited connector down to 45s and a hand as strong as KQo
HJ is a big fish. Any 2 suited here is his limp. Hes also pretty passive.
CO seems to be on the tighter end, he value bets marginal holdings, but seems to be passive(rarely raises).
BB is on tilt and way too loose(but he thinks hes damn good)

Im on the button with AJo

UTG limps, MP limps, HJ limps, CO limps, I raise, BB calls, all call.

Flop: QT8 with 2 diamonds (i have none)
checked to me, I bet. bb calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP folds, CO calls.

Turn: J(not diamond)
checked to cutoff who bets... hero folds...

Re: 20/40 Hand
 

borderline. Unfortunate about your position on the turn. If you could get away with only one bet on the turn, this is a call. You have 2-3 outs to a split pot and 4 outs to a win. CO has 97, T9, 98, etc etc.

Re: 20/40 Hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
CO seems to be on the tighter end, he value bets marginal holdings, but seems to be passive(rarely raises).


[/ QUOTE ]

Which is it? Will he bet KQ here? what about JT, or QJ? cleary you're behind, but you might have more outs then you think. I'm not sure what the right move is here, but I think I call. If one of the passive players behind you raises, I think you can re-evaluate and assume that you have 3 outs.

lf

Re: 20/40 Hand
 

i dont think there are any contradictions in my description of CO.

Re: 20/40 Hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
i dont think there are any contradictions in my description of CO.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you say so, I don't usually co-associate "passive" and "makes thin value bets". If you meant that he will bet light but won't raise light, which I guess you hinted at, then ok.

That doesn't answer the rest of the questions, however, does the villian need a straight to bet here, I think thats what you need to establish.

lf

Re: 20/40 Hand
 

If I knew he only bets here with a straight or not, why would I be here?

Re: 20/40 Hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i dont think there are any contradictions in my description of CO.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you say so, I don't usually co-associate "passive" and "makes thin value bets". If you meant that he will bet light but won't raise light, which I guess you hinted at, then ok.

That doesn't answer the rest of the questions, however, does the villian need a straight to bet here, I think thats what you need to establish.

lf

[/ QUOTE ]youve never seen a tricky player that rarely raises people but will make marginal value bets? If he is bet into hes usually pretty tight and will fold? I think my description is almost as descriptive as possible.

Re: 20/40 Hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
youve never seen a tricky player that rarely raises people but will make marginal value bets? If he is bet into hes usually pretty tight and will fold?

[/ QUOTE ]

Honestly no, not that I recall. Most players that are aware enough to make thin value bets will also make thin value/bluff/semi-bluff raises. I don't think i've ever encountered a player whose betting standards are low but whose raising standards are extremely high.

Seeing as how he bet, then, and didn't try to c/r you, i'd figure that he's trying to protect 2pair, and that you can probably assume about 4.5 outs (including straight outs, 2 pair outs, and counterfeit outs). I'd call. If it gets raised behind me, re-evaluate based on pot size and assume 3 outs.

lf