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-   -   tough 55 hand (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=406088)

wdeadwyler 12-28-2005 02:23 AM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
I think villain could of easily backdoored into a flush with hearts and think you have a king or something. Is he the type to semibluff this turn? He could also have something like AQs and have thought his hand was best.
I'd put him on QQ, a flush, or trips kings most likely (It is weird to check the kings twice I agree).
I dont like folding here to an unknown, you said you only hand 30 hands on him. What does the massive overbet from this player make you think?

orange 12-28-2005 02:26 AM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
Can you explain your reasoning for the small turn bet? Was it to induce action? I think I 3-bet this turn. River is tough.

Isura 12-28-2005 02:29 AM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
[ QUOTE ]
What does the massive overbet from this player make you think?

[/ QUOTE ]

At .5/1 I find it is usually close to the nuts (atleast at party).

ClaytonN 12-28-2005 02:55 AM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
I'm betting the turn a little harder and sure as hell 3-betting

Fallen Hero 12-28-2005 12:00 PM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
[ QUOTE ]
I'm betting the turn a little harder and sure as hell 3-betting

[/ QUOTE ]

it seems so obvious the guy has KK or QQ, 3beting is ...bah

Isura 12-28-2005 12:05 PM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
[ QUOTE ]
Can you explain your reasoning for the small turn bet? Was it to induce action? I think I 3-bet this turn. River is tough.

[/ QUOTE ]

It was a stupid turn bet. I think I should have checked the turn and called any river. I was trying to bet an amount that AK-AQ could call down, and still get away from KK-QQ. I don't understand why everyone wants to go broke on this hand... Whould someone really play AK or AQ this way? AA is possible, but KK-QQ seems way more likely.

GrunchCan 12-28-2005 12:15 PM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
I was originally going to say 3-bet the turn, but then I reconsidered after reading Fallen Hero's post. Now I put the opponent's range at: AA, KK, QQ or AK. Each equally possible.

AA = 6 ways
KK = 3 ways
QQ = 3 ways
AK = 16 ways

So, there are 22 hands you beat, and 6 which beat you.

This sounds like value-bet time to me. Which brings me back to 3-betting.

Who agrees or disagrees with my range & my line?

Fallen Hero 12-28-2005 12:23 PM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
[ QUOTE ]
I was originally going to say 3-bet the turn, but then I reconsidered after reading Fallen Hero's post. Now I put the opponent's range at: AA, KK, QQ or AK. Each equally possible.

AA = 6 ways
KK = 3 ways
QQ = 3 ways
AK = 16 ways

So, there are 22 hands you beat, and 6 which beat you.

This sounds like value-bet time to me. Which brings me back to 3-betting.

Who agrees or disagrees with my range & my line?

[/ QUOTE ]

even if they are all equally possible I think AK and AA fold to a turn 3bet while KK and QQ stack you, so I don't think there's any value in that.

PS: I don't think they are equally possible but it isn't an easy situation to quantify so I'd probably just do the same math you did and keep a mental note that the situation isn't as favorable as the math will show

GrunchCan 12-28-2005 12:28 PM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
[ QUOTE ]
I think AK and AA fold to a turn 3bet

[/ QUOTE ]

How often?

Fallen Hero 12-28-2005 12:42 PM

Re: tough 55 hand
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think AK and AA fold to a turn 3bet

[/ QUOTE ]

How often?

[/ QUOTE ]

well, I'd fold 100% (unless I had AKh, wich we know by the river villain doesn't have). If I have to give a number I'd say at least 75% of villains fold AK and AA here, do you disagree?


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