Made my hand, fold again?
 

This one happened today. 2-4nl me and villan are both deep, like 800. He seems tricky enough, a thinking player. AMybe a bit loose preflop.

He limps, I limp on the button with K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. blinds come along and the flop comes T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]


Cgecked to villan, he bets 10. I riase to 35. Villan is onyl caller. 85 in pot. Turn is the 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Villan leads for 50. I call. River is the J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Villan leads for 150 into 185 pot. CALL?????

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

Please go back and replay this hand and tell me the purpose of your flop raise. As played you go from a raiser to a caller. The worst of all possible cards comes on the turn. completing the flush and pairing the board and missing you entirely, except for a back door flush draw. Why are you putting yourself in these predicaments. since the only purpose in calling the turn bet is to take a shot at the 2nd nut flush draw how can you not call this bet? When villain leads the turn into the made flush and paired board you think he's going to check fold at the river?

With four limpers what kind of flop are you looking for with KTo? On the button I think you should mix it up and bring this trash in for a raise of fold.

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

Why play KTo preflop? If you do at least raise and play position...

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

People are pretty passive and I like to see flops. I dont want to rev the game up and make every flop expensive, I play better postflop than most in the game so I dont want to start raisng these hands.

I raised the flop to gain advantage, normally they dont bet out into you after you raised the flop. I wanted to win on the flop, or at least check the turn to get to river.

How wuold you have played the flop? Fold? Call? I think those both suck balls, pardon my french. I appreciate your opinions though so lets hear em.

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

pre flop seems perfectly fine.. hands like KTo are super easy and +EV to play in the best position in unraised pots

fold turn is how i play it

the spot on the river is very ugly.. there's no way he has the A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] to bet it like that.. do you really believe he has a boat?

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

If people are passive more reasons to attack... being good post flop only helps this strategy, especially from the button.

Every scare card in the book has hit this board and villan isn't slowing down despite your flop raise. Fold.

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

PF and flop are fine, although I think I prefer a raise PF in position.

Fold turn. There aren't many river cards you can like, and villian has taken initiative. He's pricing you out of your draw which is weak, I really don't think you have the best hand now. Trying to blow him off his hand is going to be expensive and probably not worth it. As is, fold river.

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

I disagree - I would call river and expect to be ahead. To me it looks like a flush that hit on the turn, but not the nut flush, that put a small bet out there looking for a raise, didn't get it, and is now betting the pot on the river with the assumption that you're not calling unless you have the A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

[ QUOTE ]
pre flop seems perfectly fine.. hands like KTo are super easy and +EV to play in the best position in unraised pots

fold turn is how i play it

the spot on the river is very ugly.. there's no way he has the A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] to bet it like that.. do you really believe he has a boat?

[/ QUOTE ]

no i dont. normally I do fold that trunw without the flush or the boat. I felt like he wanted me to fold, so I decided to disapoint him by calling.

Re: Made my hand, fold again?
 

limped pot dynamic is at work here.. everyone values their hands way less because the nuts could always be out there

for him to bet, call a nice raise, and donk bet you when a non-blank hits

seems like a trivial fold imo.. not only is KTo no good but your reverse implied odds are awful