Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

Has anyone written about whether ring games or tournaments have greater expectation for the average player? If not, does anyone have thoughts on this issue

Thanks,
Walter

Re: Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

I believe by definition an average player has neither a positive nor a negative expectation in either format.

Re: Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

With house take, the average player is a loser.

Craig

Re: Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

The ring games have a greater expectation.

I'm sure Wake up Call and Bozeman thought they were being cute with their answers but they obviously didn't bother to read your question carefully. Even if an average player has a -$1/hr expectation in ring games and -$2/hr expectation in tournaments, his expectation is still greater in the ring game. However, at that point, it's all about which is more fun.

Re: Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

I'm sure you were trying to be cute Dunasty but you should reread the initial question. Your answer is bogus and speculative like the majority of your advice wheras mine and Bozeman moreso than mine were an accurate answer to the question asked.

You just gotta dislike the high and mighty northerners.


PS: Ask Chris Moneymaker which has a higher expectation.

Re: Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

I reread the question and stand by my answer. Ring games have a higher expectation for average players even if that expectation is negative. This is mostly true because more money is taken in tournament "rake" than is taken in ring game rake.

Re: Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

Sorry,

Your first answer was clearly incorrect. The rake and tips make poker a negative sum game so 0 is clearly an incorrect answer. Also due to the high variance of the game and the skill involved, there are a small number of players that do very well, a few who make some money, but the vast majority are losers. Which also shows your answer is wrong.

Re: Anyone going to answer the question?
 

He wants to knwo if he can make more playing tournaments or ring games.
From my experience I can make more money playing tournaments. However, I play several $30, $50 tournaments a week, not just SNG

Re: Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

*groan*

anyway...

if by 'average' player you mean a player who would have a 0 expecation without a house drop, then tournaments are generally cheaper to play, although it depends on the buy-in and/or ring game limits you would play. online, you might play 1/2 with $60 in rake per hour, which is -$6/hour for the average player. or you could enter a $20+2 tournament and spend an average of one hour in the tourney, losing $2.

this answer is flawed, however, because 'average' players generally do very poorly in tournaments. even Moneymaker played well on the last day at the WSOP, though he was lucky at times.

if by 'average' player you mean someone who can win in the long run, though not much, it primarily depends on how well the player understands tournament poker concepts. i would say the person with no knowledge is better off in a ring game, but an educated one should play tournaments.

Re: Hourly Rate in Tournaments vs. Ring Games
 

Good ring games players usually average ~ 1-2BB/hr unless the games are very soft. Good tournament players average about 2 * buy-in in tournament winnings. So it would depend on how high a ring game you could win vs. how big a buy in tournaments you would play and how long you would spend playing in a tournament.

From personal experience I would say ring games have greater expection.