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-   -   Qxo in the SB. (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=403030)

BigEndian 12-21-2005 08:00 PM

Qxo in the SB.
 
The BB was a lagtard, but after I limp-capped with 88 in that previous hand his nuts shrank when I entered the pot.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (3 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero checks, BB checks, MP2 checks.

Turn: (1.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, MP2 folds, Hero calls.

River: (3.50 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB calls.

Final Pot: 5.50 BB

- Jim

12-21-2005 09:02 PM

Re: Qxo in the SB.
 
Obviously the standard play on the turn wouldve been to bet your hand yourself, but if you believe the BB will bet this turn with many hands worse than yours including many bluffs that he would fold if you bet, then I like your play of checking it and letting him bet. Given that the BB did bet, I also liked the fact that you just called, since the probability that the BB is bluffing with no outs to beat your hand is too high to play back at him, it is better to play meekly and keep him around and try to get another bet out of him on the river.

Once at the river, first lets notice that bet/folding or check/folding is not an option against this foe. So its between bet/call or check/call. I prefer check/calling over bet/calling becuz there is still a chance the lag has no hand that he will bet on the end as a hopeless bluff but will not call if you bet. Plus the times the lag actually has a better hand than you, bet calling will cost you more money. Bet/calling does allow you to pick up bets from lesser hands, but the lag may very well bet these lesser hands anyways. For these reasons, I like check/call over bet/call.

SGS 12-21-2005 09:21 PM

Re: Qxo in the SB.
 
I think I would want to protect my hand on the turn.

SGS

12-22-2005 12:14 AM

Re: Qxo in the SB.
 
[ QUOTE ]
I think I would want to protect my hand on the turn.

SGS

[/ QUOTE ]
In general this would be the right play. But there are two key variables here that I believe makes checking the turn much better than betting.

1) The lag on the heros left will bet this turn with many hands he probably wouldnt call with.

2) There is only 1.5BB in this pot. In this kind of extreme small pot, protecting the hero's hand should be a secondary concern, the chief concern for the hero is finding the best strategy that may squeeze out an extra big bet or two from his opponents.

In very small pots like this, finding a way to win an extra big bet or two is actually more important than winning the pot itself. With a lag player in the pot that will likely bluff this turn given the fact that everybody showed weakness on the flop, the hero has the perfect traping hand, top pair. So checking in this situation is much better than betting IMO

Sometimes this strategy will backfire and it will get checked around and something like an ace will hit the river and the hero will lose the pot, but since the pot is very small, the reward of winning a few extra big bets far outweighs the risk of losing the pot.

goofball 12-22-2005 04:41 AM

Re: Qxo in the SB.
 
You checked, LAG bet. Perfect. Why didn't you then raise? Get the extra BB out of him.

12-22-2005 08:23 AM

Re: Qxo in the SB.
 
Great replies Westley878.

River: How often will the lag bet again with nothing and what does your bet tell him?
Against a less skilled lag who will call the river light and is reluctant to bluff again, the bet-call route could be the proper move.
Against a tough lag who will lay down a lot of hands, the check-call is usually the way to go.

sy_or_bust 12-22-2005 01:03 PM

Re: Qxo in the SB.
 
nice turn check, but raise. he'll invent reasons to call w/ junk, and show down any piece. your line only gets a river bet when LAG bluff-raises or hits some part of the board he would've called a turn c/r with anyway.

12-22-2005 07:26 PM

Re: Qxo in the SB.
 
There is no need to checkraise that turn. A checkraise is just too strong of a move. Since it is a small pot, a river suckout isn't that big of an issue. A checkraise should be knocking out a lot of hands that would betting hands that you could beat, let them keep betting.

At this point, my guess is that the bettor is putting you on a draw, babies, 6, 8, or T with a weak kicker. Let him bet accordingly. A checkraise will fold many hands that would have put another bet in on the river. I don't expect many people to be calling your check raise with less than a T with a good kicker. And you can't beat much more than that.


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