Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

It's time I got started studying my play and the game in general a lot more, so here's what I intend to be the first of many poorly played hands!

BB was IRO 20/5/1.5
UTG was IRO 40/11/0.7
UTG+1 had only just sat down and was unknown.

IMHO, I turn super weak when an overcard to my pocket pair appears.

On the flop, my raise was intended to fold out a weak ace form BB + UTG.

Turn, as expected, it was checked to me - what's my line here against an unknown?

River, checked to me again (!). I am happy with my decision to bet here.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB folds, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (6.25 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG+1 checks, Hero checks.

River: (6.25 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG+1 calls.

Final Pot: 8.25 BB

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

[ QUOTE ]
On the flop, my raise was intended to fold out a weak ace form BB + UTG

[/ QUOTE ]
i ignored the rest of the post to focus on this. don't ever use this thinking again to determine a course of action and you'll be much better off.

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

What's IRO?

I would bet the turn, and that would be the last money I put in.

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

bet the turn check behind on the river is another line you can use. I don't think I am betting that river.

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
On the flop, my raise was intended to fold out a weak ace form BB + UTG

[/ QUOTE ]
i ignored the rest of the post to focus on this. don't ever use this thinking again to determine a course of action and you'll be much better off.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you elaborate a little more on this? Is it because top pair will rarely, if ever, be folded in the micro limits?

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

I think I would bet the turn but not put any more money in after that, ie fold to a turn checkraise or if he donkbets the river. Otherwise I would check behind on the river.

BBB

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
On the flop, my raise was intended to fold out a weak ace form BB + UTG

[/ QUOTE ]
i ignored the rest of the post to focus on this. don't ever use this thinking again to determine a course of action and you'll be much better off.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you elaborate a little more on this? Is it because top pair will rarely, if ever, be folded in the micro limits?

[/ QUOTE ]

rarely folded anywhere anylimit, and never to a flop raise

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

[ QUOTE ]
What's IRO?

[/ QUOTE ]

In (the) Region Of

mylesdyson, point taken for the reason other people offer, I am concious that I need to be less weak tight in these situations, this is probably why I looked too hard for an excuse to make an agro move.

However, this leaves that question, what's my line on the flop?

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

flop is fine, as long as you 3-bet if it comes back one to you.

bet the turn, free card on river

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

[ QUOTE ]
flop is fine, as long as you 3-bet if it comes back one to you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you mean cap if it comes back to me?

Are we ever really ahead when we get reraised here?

Are we just trying to retain the impetus so that the next two streets go UTG+1 checks, here bets, UTG+1 checks, here checks?

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

with his check on the turn, bet it. you may induce a weak A fold. More than likely not.

With your check behind on the turn this guy KNOWS all he he has to do on the river is check/call and he has you.

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

I like your play through the flop. I think you want to see a cheap showdown here if you don't meet with much resistance, and if you don't raise the flop, you'll have to call all the way. Plus if you get 3-bet or bet into again, I feel pretty confident about a laydown against most players.

With no one acting behind you, I'm fine with taking the free card on the turn, with the expectation that you'll call one on the river if he bets out again (in hopes that you induced a bluff). I think turn bet is ok too, folding for one more bet past that.

I'm continually surprised with what people will call with, but I'll take the free showdown on the river every time here.

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

Grunch

?

If you are so certain he doesn't have an ace, you have to bet the turn.

Myself, I play that flop exactly the same way.

I bet the turn when checked to and if called, I'll check behind on the river.

You will almost NEVER fold a pair of aces with this board. Most of these A-rag jokers are just trying to get to showdown and see if, indeed, you do have a better kicker.

More often, with KK with an A on the flop and I have position, I raise as you did on the flop, then I'll check behind on the turn, then I'll call 1 or check behind on the river. Show it down, take my loss, and move on.

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

Good chance villain has ace-rag, sucks but I think a bet on the river is ok. Why did you raise the flop, for info? I think the info you got is that your beat.

Re: Pocket Pairs (KK) - I\'m Totally Clueless
 

I think all the flop raise does is "find the ace".
Once you found it your only hope was that he's weak enough to fold top pair if his kicker is weak as well. The only way to achieve that is to bet again on the turn.
When you checked behind, he HAS to call your river bet.
Notice that you lose the same amount by betting turn, checking behind on river and give yourself a (small) chance to steal the pot from unknown player.