Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

Hey guys,

Party 30 10-handed. Bad MP limps, folded to me and I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] on the Button. SB folds, decent aggro BB calls, MP calls.

Flop comes: A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Checked to me and I bet. BB raises, MP folds, I take a bit and call.

Turn comes: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

BB bets, I call in rhythm.

River comes: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

BB bets, I raise in rhythm intended to fold to a 3bet.

GoT

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

Looks like you're trying to get value from the Ax hands that will usually call you. And a lot of hands that have you beat will be shy to 3-bet with the board paired.

- Jim

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

vnh. would you have raised the river if the board did not pair or some other scare card did not fall(a 3rd heart, etc.)? many players back off of the river raises and only call, fearing a draw came in for the raiser. was this raise necessarily a product of the paired board, or was this part of your plan since the flop call?

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

so next time we play should i start with SSS or PPP? i think bakkubakku is going to start with RRR maybe 60% of hte time and PPP 40% of the time, but i don't think he ever starts with SSS.

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

it is it so far off to say he could have 9-8??

he probably would have raised w/ any ace.. and he raised the flop.. its that or he could have JQ, but he probably would have raised PF w/ that too..

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

If you are intending to fold to a three bet with that much money in the pot, then why not simply call on the river?

Also, a raise for value here on the turn would have been nice. I like you putting him on 89, but if that's your read, then why not make him pay to find his 14 outer?

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

[ QUOTE ]
If you are intending to fold to a three bet with that much money in the pot, then why not simply call on the river?

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this doesn't make any sense. there are times when raising is +EV against a hand range when called, but a 3-bet indicates you are crushed and should fold. this may or may not be one of these times, but your logic is very bad.

[ QUOTE ]
Also, a raise for value here on the turn would have been nice. I like you putting him on 89, but if that's your read, then why not make him pay to find his 14 outer?

[/ QUOTE ]

nobody puts an opponent squarely on 98 by the turn - that is truly terrible. It is a possible worse hand, as is any ace, ten, some sevens and PPs, or random stuff like QJ. The vast majority of these worse hands fold immediately to the turn raise, whereas calling the turn and raising the river extracts at least an extra bet from weaker hands that value bet and and the same # from busted draws that bluff.

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

looks good. weaker aces will probably call, and as a bonus the A7/T7 hands are pissed now, whereas they might have pushed you off your hand had you raised the turn.

this board isn't great for the play because few non-ace hands will bet the river, but raising the turn is poor. the aces are still often calling (just as they are bet/calling the river most often), because big PPs might do this for fold equity, but the raise kills the few hands that don't have many outs but will bet the river anyway. also, since it looks like hero is isolating a weak player, there is the chance BB will be more inclined to play aggressively on the turn without an ace. a lot of players won't do this, but 3-betting OOP w/ something like KT is one way to destroy KK-JJ and any worse hand fooling around (planning to check/fold the river). when shown down, shania loves it.

by comparison, the river raise is innately stronger and much less likely to be 3-bet weakly.

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

I think your use of superlatives and grammar are also bad. However, I do see your point as to playing the turn, and it's a very good one. One thing I might add is that if you read your aggro opponent for a draw (I think that reading opponents is part of the game, no?), then raising on the turn will guarantee you earning your extra bet. He may just check/fold on the river, and you'll lose your bet. If, however, you think that he has a weak ace or pocket pair, then fine, a call is all well and good. He'll bet again and you can raise.

I guess I'm still learning, so thanks for the response.

Argun

Re: Long Time No Post : AJo on the Button
 

[ QUOTE ]
weaker aces will probably call, and as a bonus the A7/T7 hands are pissed now

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Just a little thing, but AT is still ahead of him.