Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

4/8 Live at Riverrock Casino

Generally passive table with the exception of UTG and UTG+1
UTG is a little less passive than most, but his aggression is generally misplaced. I seen him check raise w/ mid pair, raise w/ KJo in the SB, etc.

UTG+1 has only been at the table for around 20 mins. Slightly loose (my estimate is the 30% vpip type). Post flop plays ok, but likes to call down though imo. Loves to make comments to make him look knowledgeable even when hes not in a hand (i.e. "so you must be on a flush draw" or "you were scared of the ace?", etc. etc.)

Hero is MP3 and dealt T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 1 more call, I call in MP3, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

A little loose call preflop but nice pot size too given the LPPs.

Flop comes

Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Checks to UTG who bets, UTG+1 raises, folds to me, Hero???

I put UTG and UTG+1 on a high [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], probably A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] or K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] for UTG+1

Do you 3 bet here? or wait until a safe turn to pop it? Is this a classic wait until the turn hand?

If [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] falls on turn, do you call hoping to make a boat on the river?

Thanks!

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

Preflop looks ok given the loose table reads.

This looks like a wait til the turn hand to me.

Given the table stats if a spade falls your drawing to 4-outs. Looks like the pot should be big enough to see river.

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

really 10 8 from middle position? am I missing something?

It seems to me if you wan't to play this against the two villians already in the pot then you should raise.

Or am I crazy?

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

there are 3 limpers already in.. this is not a loose limp.

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

Pre-flop is fine here.

On the flop, you really should wait until the turn. Raise any non-[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J, 9, or Q turn.

Consider folding if any of those cards hit.

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

ooops missed the third limp, disregard

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

[ QUOTE ]
4/8 Live at Riverrock Casino

Generally passive table with the exception of UTG and UTG+1
UTG is a little less passive than most, but his aggression is generally misplaced. I seen him check raise w/ mid pair, raise w/ KJo in the SB, etc.

UTG+1 has only been at the table for around 20 mins. Slightly loose (my estimate is the 30% vpip type). Post flop plays ok, but likes to call down though imo. Loves to make comments to make him look knowledgeable even when hes not in a hand (i.e. "so you must be on a flush draw" or "you were scared of the ace?", etc. etc.)

Hero is MP3 and dealt T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 1 more call, I call in MP3, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

A little loose call preflop but nice pot size too given the LPPs.

Flop comes

Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Checks to UTG who bets, UTG+1 raises, folds to me, Hero???

I put UTG and UTG+1 on a high [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], probably A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] or K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] for UTG+1

Do you 3 bet here? or wait until a safe turn to pop it? Is this a classic wait until the turn hand?

If [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] falls on turn, do you call hoping to make a boat on the river?

Thanks!

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a classic fold your bottom two pair on the flop for 2 bets hand. I really don't like the mindset of some ppl to 'put them on a hand I am ahead of'.

One is betting the K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] with a pair, the other is raising the naked A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I'd limp preflop as well, but I'm not even sure you are ahead on the flop. I'd muck.

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

Given the loose action, mucking on the flop doesn't seem like a very good idea. Remember that the odds of a player flopping a flush are 1 in 117, I will gladly be wrong once in order to be right 116 times.

But lo and behold, their aren't too many cards that can come on the turn that will make me happy. I would be inclined to wait until the turn to attemp a raise, but also be mindful that nobody is going to let go of any spade, so it would probably be a good idea to dump if a spade hits, but that depends on the good ole' confidence meter. I probably would not attempt a value bet in the end, but then again, that totally depends.

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

Preflop is nice, I would maybe like one more caller but with a passive table, all good.

Perfect hand to call then raise the turn to kingdom come on a non-scare card, you got position on a co-ordinated board with a UTG+1 wannabe and a bizarro player.

If a scare card does hit you will most likely have odds to call the turn to hit your boat.

Re: Live Hand: Pop it now or later?
 

Really? Thats a little weak tight don't you think? As for the "mindset" its based on what is likely since it is very difficult to put either of them on a hand due to their loose limping ranges.

On the flop we're behind a made flush (over 100:1), made straight J9 (another long shot), QQ, TT, 88 and QT and Q8. QQ we would likely have seen a raise preflop, TT or 88 only 1 combo each since I have the T and 8. QT and Q8 are somewhat reasonable possibilities (again I already have a T and 8). Anything else I'm ahead of. I'm ahead more often than not. With a straight and flush draw, its about 50/50. So what are you putting them on here? What are we fearing?

Don't forget we're getting something like 11:2 here.

Results soon.


[ QUOTE ]

This is a classic fold your bottom two pair on the flop for 2 bets hand. I really don't like the mindset of some ppl to 'put them on a hand I am ahead of'.

One is betting the K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] with a pair, the other is raising the naked A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I'd limp preflop as well, but I'm not even sure you are ahead on the flop. I'd muck.

[/ QUOTE ]