Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

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I don't like the preflop raise because we're out of position. Why put extra bets in when the only way we're playing past the flop is if we hit? Put in the minimum and we'll have these limpers dominated if a Q or A is on the flop (which means they'll put in extra bets against us).


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I didnt see your argument when I posted, we were writting at the same time =). I don't know, I dont like giving the bb a free look at the board when i have a good hand. I would rather them fold than let them see the flop for free with 84 and make me draw into two backdoor draws. Well that doesn't always happen, it is probable enough that I rarely slowplay anything because I would rather occasionally steal the blinds than let other players outdraw me for free.

Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

Just for the record, I raise AQs in the sb.

AQo isn't a bad hand, its just that a preflop raise here won't give us position, or make more marginal hands fold (we make the assumption that the preflop callers will call another). So we already know whos in the pot, why make them pay extra now when we can make them pay more later?

Also limping with AK is bad because it encourages more hands to call behind us, giving us less position, and a broader spectrum of possible hands, which makes for difficult post flop decisions when theres a lot of raising going on in front of us and we've only hit top pair.


Also, don't look at what cards there could be, look at what we have to do to win this hand. We have to pick up an Ace or Queen (ace high probably won't win at this level), our only out is an ace if someone has a king, and thats all considering no one has a 4, or a mid pocket pair. We have no draws to a better hand then 3 of a kind. The pots small, so why fight for it vs 3 random hands in front of us?

Folding the turn UI is bad when we bet out on the flop. Now we check the turn. Anyone worth their salt in poker will probably bet into us, whether they picked up a pair with the blank or not. Now the hand is all weird, we're unable to nail our opponents to any hands, we're out of position, why pay extra chips to be in this horrible position?

Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

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I didnt see your argument when I posted, we were writting at the same time =). I don't know, I dont like giving the bb a free look at the board when i have a good hand. I would rather them fold than let them see the flop for free with 84 and make me draw into two backdoor draws. Well that doesn't always happen, it is probable enough that I rarely slowplay anything because I would rather occasionally steal the blinds than let other players outdraw me for free.

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This isn't slow playing btw, slow playing is when you do it with a made hand. AQ isn't a made hand. BB is going to get 7:1 on his call, counting implied odds, so I think he's calling with 84 anyway.

And remember, this is an easy raise from any position other than the sb preflop.

Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

You only complete AQo out of the SB, and only bet if an A or a Q hit the flop? I don't like that play at all. With 4 players, how good is your hand?

I raise that preflop. On this flop, I bet out, call a raise, and wait for the turn.

[edit] Just saw your reply...you're not raising to push people out, you're raising for value.

Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

I never said that, but who is reckless enough to lead AQ out with a K44 board with 3 unknown left to act?

T42 board with 2 of the same suit as one of our broadways is what I lead out on.

Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

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who is reckless enough to lead AQ out with a K44 board with 3 unknown left to act?


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Apparently me. But maybe not anymore. Thanks for everyone's thoughts.

Results
 

Thanks for the thoughts everyone.

After I check-raised the flop BB, UTG+1, and Button all folded and I took it down. That certainly doesn't mean the check-raise was correct, but it worked in this spot.

Thanks again.

Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

If you raise AQo in your position, it makes it easier to lead out on the flop than if you just complete. Again, you're raising for value here.

You have the 13th best hand preflop (based on pokerroom's EV) and you aren't raising because you're in the SB against three other limpers? I have a hard time understanding this, personally. Sure, you're out of position, but you probably have the best hand out of these limpers.

Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

agreed, with two limpers (no reads?) and the BB id raise for value. chances are you have the best hand.

Re: Party .5/1: AQo in the SB
 

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If you raise AQo in your position, it makes it easier to lead out on the flop than if you just complete. Again, you're raising for value here.

You have the 13th best hand preflop (based on pokerroom's EV) and you aren't raising because you're in the SB against three other limpers? I have a hard time understanding this, personally. Sure, you're out of position, but you probably have the best hand out of these limpers.

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Because you can extract more money if you hit, less money if you miss. AQo vs 3 limpers needs top pair, if you don't you've wasted money. Once you have top pair, then start to charge them. You'll make more money.