Making a big laydown
 

Party 15/30 6-max

It is my 23rd hand at the table. In such a short time, I'll only notice if an opponent has any clear flaws - so far, villian has none. I figure he's tight-aggressive.

Villian opens UTG. I 3-bet from CO with AQo. Folded back to him and he calls.

Flop is QJ2, all clubs. I do not have a club.

He bets, I raise, he 3-bets fast.

It's the kind of fast 3-bet you see when someone's got a good gamble goin'. I felt pretty strongly that he had the Ac or Kc, and his other card was a pair (but not AA or KK because he did not cap preflop). Or, maybe he was getting fancy with AcKx, AxKc, Ac irrelevant kicker.

Turn was the 5d.

He bet, I raised, he pauses for a couple seconds and calls.

River is the Kh.

He bets.

Who votes for folding?

Re: Making a big laydown
 

Just call down after his flop 3 bet.

Re: Making a big laydown
 

I'd call because I probably want some more information on how this guy plays and the pot is big enough that he is possibly taking a stab at it. I like the rest

Re: Making a big laydown
 

You don't think A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] makes this play sometimes? Or worse? I sometimes see aggressive players 3-bet this flop very loosely with some sort of hand and a club redraw, hoping to push you off a better hand on a 4-flush. 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] comes to mind. You're beat a lot, but the pot is too big to fold here IMO.

Re: Making a big laydown
 

"You don't think AcJx makes this play sometimes?"

He definitely could have had that on the flop. But I 3-bet pf, raised the flop, and raised the turn. The hand I actually have is on the low end of the range he should put me on, so if he has AcJx he probably sees it as a bluff-catcher only and will check and call the river. Same with 9c9x. Or at least that was what was running through my head at the time.

Re: Making a big laydown
 

Don't raise the turn. The three clubs are a giant hole in your pot equity because of the draw they create. Just call down.

I'll never understand players who put a ton of action in and then fold for no particular reason. Learn to use the turn raise bet to pay for the river instead. You don't even have a real read on this guy and you are putting him on a tight hand range and talking about what he thinks you could have. Are you sure he even thinks at all?

By playing the hand as you did, you risked the pot to try and squeeze out a small fraction of a bet with a thin value raise.

Re: Making a big laydown
 

your play thus far is good, i would fold the river.

Re: Making a big laydown
 

Call the turn, call the river. You take away his aggression powers by doing that.

Re: Making a big laydown
 

"Learn to use the turn raise bet to pay for the river instead."

It's funny, I've had quite a bit of success learning to put my river call in as a turn raise instead. Admittedly, that is a better play when I have a chance to improve, where here I don't.

Re: Making a big laydown
 

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I'll never understand players who put a ton of action in and then fold for no particular reason. Learn to use the turn raise bet to pay for the river instead

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[ QUOTE ]
It's funny, I've had quite a bit of success learning to put my river call in as a turn raise instead. Admittedly, that is a better play when I have a chance to improve, where here I don't.

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I'm not saying you can never make the free showdown play, but you have two huge issues here:

1. Your hand is too good not to show. Don't commit to any plan that involves investing a lot of money and then folding, especially with no read to support your laydown. That is what my quote up top is all about. Find a way to showdown strong hands when you are heads up.

2. The free showdown machinery is flawed because of the 3-flush. Normal rules about checking to the player with the initiative don't apply. The fact that you raised the turn won't mean anything if the fourth club hits.