ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

this is the same game as the last post but now 4 handed, villian is again smarx and the effective stack size is 8.7k. this hand took place about 15-20 hands after the last one.

i open raise for 175 one off the button with K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], only the villian calls out of the sb. the flop is 3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and the villian bets 375, i call. turn is Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], he bets 500 and i call. the river is the 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], he checks, i bet 1500 and he raises to 4500.

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

Of the three you have posted so far, this is by far the most clear cut. Easy, easy, fold imo.

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

Hi cwl,

Wow. I'm really surprised you bet 1500 on the end without knowing how to handle a raise. I tend to play safe here against non-idiots, and check behind. Maybe that leaves some money on the table vs AJ/QQ, but I can live with it. When I say "without knowing how to handle a raise," I mean that I'd probably only bet this amount if I thought there was a high chance he'd bluff-raise me. So I'd rarely bet the river, but if I did, I'd move all-in to represent a busted draw or stone bluff. In the very rare case that I bet the pot, I'd be doing it with the intention/hope of calling a lunatic's raise.

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

with the stack sizes in play a river allin is a pretty big overbet. i dont normally bet like that and without having given him some reason to interpret that bet as a bluff i think its a mistake.

if the river bet has enough value then its worth making even when getting raised is awful. you may well be aware of this and just didnt think there was enough value in the bet to make it worth the risk. i guess all i mean to say is that its important to consider how much value the bet potentially has as well as how bad getting raised is and to try to correctly balance the two. whether i did that properly in this hand i dont really know, i dont think its clear cut.

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

i thnk the river is a clear value bet. looks like he'll have a medium strength hand and call with it a lot of the time. as to his c/r not sure what to do it is tough spot.

maybe a flop raise was in order though, hand just feels like it will play out better that way.

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

I think you should fold, his hand just look more like 54(is he loose enough to call with that here?) than a flush draw(a flush draw check-raising the river is somewhat weird move), I doubt a set play this way but its a possibility so this adds move combos of hands you cant beat. Just doesnt seem he would have the guts to check-raise with fshdraw after facing a 'scary' 1.5K bet

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

Does anyone but me think it depends on what you did in the previous hands? If he thinks you will fold to a CR whenever a draw appears to hit, why not go for it?

Sabre170

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

[ QUOTE ]
this is the same game as the last post but now 4 handed, villian is again smarx and the effective stack size is 8.7k. this hand took place about 15-20 hands after the last one.

i open raise for 175 one off the button with K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], only the villian calls out of the sb. the flop is 3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and the villian bets 375, i call. turn is Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], he bets 500 and i call. the river is the 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], he checks, i bet 1500 and he raises to 4500.

[/ QUOTE ]

i fold this one pretty rapidly.

fim

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

Just curious, why no turn raise?

Re: ub 25-50 river checkraise #3
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just curious, why no turn raise?

[/ QUOTE ]

basically just pot control, getting some river bluffs from missed draws, winning more from worse made hands, not getting blown off the pot, etc. for good or for bad ive noticed that in a lot of the hands that get posted and commented on i seem much less inclined to raise in spots like this than many posters.