its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

button in this hand loves to play his cards, he bets or raises any pair/draw, and loves to bet when checked to. Other guy is unkown but he posted UTG so my money is on him being teh suck.

I get A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] in the BB

UTG poster checks, folded to button who calls, SB folds, I raise, everyone calls

flop: (6sb) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I bet, call, call

turn: (4.5BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I check, UTG checks, button checks

River: (4.5BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I check, utg checks, button bets, I raise


basically I think button is full of [censored] here, but am I better of calling or raising?

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

I just call. What makes you think that you need to fold UTG? Does the button call your CR with a worse Ace? I'm not really seeing any benefit to raising here. The pot seems to small to try and put forth the effort to fold 5x, which might not even fold considering he's dumb enough to post.

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

I bet the turn 100%.

Also, I call the river. Can't button be over-calling your flop with a 3 (or 5) that he doesn't love until the river? Sure, he could have a zillion other hands, but why risk it when there's no reason to fear UTG?

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

Now your raise doesn't make any sense from a "what hands could he logically play this way?" sense...but these opponents are probably too unobservant to figure that out. I think the raise may fold out a weak 5 that UTG might be holding, but the pot is really small so I'm happy to just call because i figure UTG doesn't have an overcalling hand often.

Surf

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

i think calling, because he will probably not fold a better hand to a raise.

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

Why no turn bet?

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

Your line doesn't look like a big overpair or a Q so I think you're better off calling and picking off worse no additional pair to the 3s hands.

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

I orginally liked the c/r on the river, but after looking at it some more I think just calling is better because the pot is small. If you just call you're investing 1BB to win a 6.5BB pot. To make investing the extra bet worthwhile you have to get UTG to fold a better hand 1/6.5 times (~15%). I don't think UTG has 5x or 8x here 15% of the time.

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

[ QUOTE ]
I bet the turn 100%.

[/ QUOTE ]

I really don't like betting this turn. Check/fold is my default here. We have to consider what 2 opponents would be calling with on a queen high board with no flush draw and only a few really low straight draws. It's pretty unlikely that we are not against a better hand on the turn. There's only one combination of 2 overcards (which is extremely unlikely) and few draws available in the playing range.

I think the river raise is very interesting given the likelyhood utg lays down a better hand.

Re: its 2pm and I still havent eaten breakfast
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I bet the turn 100%.

[/ QUOTE ]

I really don't like betting this turn. Check/fold is my default here. We have to consider what 2 opponents would be calling with on a queen high board with no flush draw and only a few really low straight draws. It's pretty unlikely that we are not against a better hand on the turn. There's only one combination of 2 overcards (which is extremely unlikely) and few draws available in the playing range.

I think the river raise is very interesting given the likelyhood utg lays down a better hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps I'm missing it, but to me your post seems highly contradictory. You don't like a turn bet with the thinking that at least someone has you beat, but then you'll raise the guy who ends up betting on the end. If the button's got you beat, you're losing more money. If UTG has you beat, with TP or a 3, he's likely not folding either. To me the plays are tied. If you check the turn & it goes through, you should just call the button bet. I prefer betting the turn, folding to a raise, and checking the river if they both call. I'd fire again if it's heads up and I haven't folded on the turn. Sure I'll lose to a better hand that let me bet it out for them a good portion of the time, but I'll also pick up the pot a good portion of the time.

Re-read Ed Miller's post. Bet until you're told to fold. You'll be looked up & lose a non-negligible amount of time, but the pots you'll pick up by not slowing will earn you $$$.