Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

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A better approach to this player is to wait for TPTK and raise flop, call reraise, call two more barrels.

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No it isn't. A better approach than this one would be to cut him a check for your stack directly and going to eat a piece of pizza.

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Eh? If you don't agree, it would be helpful if you actually explained why, both to me and my bankroll, because I regularly call down maniacs with TPTK.

My thoughts are based off of this hand:
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This guy was more than willing to back up his pre-flop raises with strong post-flop bets, raises, and re-raises. In one specific hand, he bet $20 into a ~$60 pot on the flop, an opponent check-raised him another $20. He re-raised $100 more. His opponent put him all-in. The guy folded, showing no hand and no draw (on a flop of A,Q,x).

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Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

Hyper aggro guys get hands too. If you're backing TPTK with your stack every time you're going to lose your stack when he makes a hand. A better strategy is to play small pots with marginal hands and big pots with big hands.

Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

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If you're backing TPTK with your stack every time you're going to lose your stack when he makes a hand.

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Agreed, but if he will fire with trash as often as he fires with a made hand (more often, because he always fires with trash, but will only pick up 2 pair or better every 5 flops or so), calling down with TPTK is +EV.

I may lose my stack when he has a hand, but I think he doubles me up more often than he stacks me. It's higher variance for sure, but playing LAGs is always higher variance. Another advantage is that if he is deep, once he doubles you up you can try to stack him again for twice as much with a real hand. Thoughts?

Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

Calling down with TPTK is fine. Raising flop, calling re-raise, and stacking off on turn and river is not fine.

Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

I agree completely with everything TWP has said in this thread.

Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

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Calling down with TPTK is fine. Raising flop, calling re-raise, and stacking off on turn and river is not fine.

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Nobody's talking about any raises. Maniac is just betting continuation whole way and we're calling down with TPTK. How is that wrong?

If maniac is betting heavy with air how are you supposed to manage pot sizes? Seems like you have to play big pots with TPTK, though of course you can still try to avoid his monsters, but only if he has any kind of patterns or sense of pot sizes and your action.

Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

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Nobody's talking about any raises. Maniac is just betting continuation whole way and we're calling down with TPTK. How is that wrong?

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I advocated raising flopped TPTK and then calling down. Respected posters think it's terrible so I'm in thinking mode =o

Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

Before reading others responses, I'd say raise min to 140$. Granted this is a sucker move, but your image right now is a weak-tight one. If is is like you said, a thinking player, he'll probably analyse that the weak tight player (you) just hit trip king. I think you win it right there every time he does'nt have a K or better, plus he might fold a bigger pp.

Also, he'll push only when you are obviously beaten so you save money compared to a bigger (or all-in) raise, witch would have the same effect as a min raise if he does'nt have a K or better but would cost you more when he does have it.

BTW, I totally hate the min raise move, I can count on two hands the number of time I do it a year... But right now, I think it as some good value

-Happy [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

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I think playing for a set is more +EV than pushing preflop and making him fold. He might just call you with a coinfip. If you hit your set you're getting paid.

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Lags rarely have hands good enough to pay you off with. The lag WANTs you to call for set value and check/fold when you miss.

Re: Caesars Palace 1-2: Deep stacks, Maniacal Bettor, 66 on a K,4,3 fl
 

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I think playing for a set is more +EV than pushing preflop and making him fold. He might just call you with a coinfip. If you hit your set you're getting paid.

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Lags rarely have hands good enough to pay you off with. The lag WANTs you to call for set value and check/fold when you miss.

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This guy isnt lag, hes a maniac ATM.
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So, he's hyper-aggressive, nearly impossible to intimidate, and enjoying himself while playing this way. But, he's not clueless. He's betting a lot. He'll make loose calls for sure. But, he's not calling huge bets with nothing.

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Second edit: OK maybe not quite ATM but you can get a good deal of money in when he raises you on the flop...

Third edit: I never said check/fold if you miss, I just do not advocate a push preflop.