check check bet
 

The line most (+ev) players take when way ahead or way behind is to c/c c/c b/f.

Since this line is extremely easy to spot when it happens against you, and we can somewhat define our opponents hand in this position, does anyone feel this would be a worthwhile spot to make a river bluff-raise?

If we got headsup by 3-betting a raise and having the blinds fold, then when we reach the river decision there will be 6.25bb's in the pot.

It would take 2bb's to bluff, so this would approximately need to work 1/3 of the time to be profitable.

I've never done this myself, and not sure I ever will. Just wondering whether anyone else sees any validity in a play like this.

Re: check check bet
 

It depends.

Post hand examples.

Re: check check bet
 

I'd imagine it depends what that river card was. If it is an obvious brick, it's not going to accomplish anything and you'd be better with c/c since the likelyhood of opponent folding to a check-raise on river for 1 more bet closing the action when a 2 of stars falls is pretty slim.

Re: check check bet
 

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I'd imagine it depends what that river card was. If it is an obvious brick, it's not going to accomplish anything and you'd be better with c/c since the likelyhood of opponent folding to a check-raise on river for 1 more bet closing the action when a 2 of stars falls is pretty slim.

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You have the positions reversed. I'm talking about when we have position, and villian who has been check/calling us all of a sudden bets out on the river.

Re: check check bet
 

It depends on the pot size, type of villain, texture of the board, what cards you have, what cards you think villain may have, action on all the other streets, etc.

Re: check check bet
 

I don't have any real hand examples but i'll give a hypothetical.

Villian is a Tag in MP2. We have QQ in CO.

Villian raises, we 3-bet and everyone fold to villian who calls.

Flop comes K25 rainbow.

check, bet, call

Turn 8

check, bet, call

River 6

bet, ???

So, a straight is possible, but given that villian is a tag we will call this a 1 in 1000000 event that he raised with 79 and called down for a runner runner straight.

The thinking is on the river that we are possibly beat by a weak king, but if he is doing the standard army issue w/a w/b line a raise might make him fold.

Re: check check bet
 

IMO the c/c c/c b/f is an unintuitive line and when someone does it, they understand WA/WB theory. I always make a note when someone showsdown a middling hand with this line.

On occasion, I'll bluff-raise someone with this note in their profile but, to be frank, I still seem to get called much of the time. What I find useful, though, is to use this info to raise a hand I would otherwise just call.

Re: check check bet
 

The problem with bluff raising is that a lot of people will call the raise out of habit (some people will always bet/call the river) or because they know that you are capable of raising with nothing. The best way to defeat this line is to fold hands worse then top pair to the river bet and raise with better hands.

It would start getting really odd if the villian knows that we will laydown QQ to a river bet (hense it would be right for him to bluff). So if the level of thinking is that high, you pretty much have to say "[censored] It" and call. If thinking is still on a lower level, you should just fold and move on.

Re: check check bet
 

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Since this line is extremely easy to spot when it happens against you, and we can somewhat define our opponents hand in this position, does anyone feel this would be a worthwhile spot to make a river bluff-raise?



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This is a consequence of using this line frequently. I have not seen it mentioned on the boards (But I am sure it has at some point). This should not be your 100% play in this situation. Sometimes it is fine to mix it up on the flop.

But yes if you are playing a longer session or are with the same people frequently. They will pick up on this move. So it is sometimes necessary to call the river raise, or as I said earlier, play fast on the flop.