opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

villain is steaming a little bit after i doubled through him with pair+fd v. his bottom set (but seems very controlled, not tilting) but is VERY aggro, seen him raise 75o UTG, he likes to check-min-raise, especially on scary boards, or when he thinks you have missed overs, etc.

what's the minimum hand you call w/ here?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) converter

CO ($103.15)
Button ($226.65)
SB ($74.75)
BB ($63.60)
UTG ($327.50)
Hero ($614.90)

Preflop: Hero is MP with BLAH, BLEH (2 cards good enough to raise pf).
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $8</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Button calls $8, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>.

Flop: ($19) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, Button checks.

Turn: ($19) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $15</font>, Button calls $15.

River: ($49) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets $52</font>

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

QT

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

a J with a decent kicker

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

Probably just a queen. I haven't shown any real strength, and theres a good chance he's just trying to take it away. A flush draw bluffs here most all the time. A steaming player makes the big bets. He could've also hit a jack.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

88/99+

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

A6+
edit - this is dumb. :P

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

hes 65/19 if anyone cares about PT stats

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

Heros line looks really weak.
I call with any queen or jack here.

why didn't hero c-bet?

Villian isin't representing anything but a missed flush.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

heros reasons for not c-betting could be anything, mostly because he is OOP, he doesnt want the pot to snowball out of control, and because villain has a tendency to bluff at weakness

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

If you think he is fos, call with ace high...

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
heros reasons for not c-betting could be anything, mostly because he is OOP, he doesnt want the pot to snowball out of control, and because villain has a tendency to bluff at weakness

[/ QUOTE ]

These reasons only make sense if you have a reasonable hand which you want to showdown. Therefore this poll is rather pointless. The decision was made on the flop, not the river.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

alright, i called w/77 and got a lot of flak for it at the table, and from someone who was watching me. he showed 98o. is this considered something i want to go to showdown with? maybe the flop was the key point, is bet still preferable over check there?

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

I either bet the flop, or just check it down all the way.

As played calling with 77 vs this guy seems pretty reasonable.

Right or wrong, I have no problem with these calls, I think they make you a lot better.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
alright, i called w/77 and got a lot of flak for it at the table, and from someone who was watching me. he showed 98o. is this considered something i want to go to showdown with? maybe the flop was the key point, is bet still preferable over check there?

[/ QUOTE ]

I am interested to see what MSNL says about this, but sometimes when I have a weak hand on a drawing board but I still feel I am ahead on the flop, I overbet the pot a bit...maybe 120%. This makes it very easy to get villian to define his hand early. Any flush draw will fold and most people won't have the balls to bluff me. It saves money since I don't have to mess around later at a higher price to see if I'm ahead. If I get caught it gives more weight when I overbet my nuts.
thoughts?

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

this is the gayest thread ever

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
this is the gayest thread ever

[/ QUOTE ]

Does that mean it is attracted to other MSNL threads?

Ah well...at least you saved it.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

AJ

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
this is the gayest thread ever

[/ QUOTE ]

Does that mean it is attracted to other MSNL threads?

Ah well...at least you saved it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Looks like I'm not missing out on much having -Skeme- on ignore.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

Well, you do get to alert others about how you have me on ignore, so that's pretty sweet, right?

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
alright, i called w/77 and got a lot of flak for it at the table, and from someone who was watching me.

[/ QUOTE ]

I never understand people who give a flak to the person who calls with a weak hand but don't give flak to the person who bets with 9 high.

Seems like the hero made a good call.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

KJ

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

ace high looks good. you look like you have nothing. he is betting a lot. if he has a pair, he should check and hope to beat your ace high.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
this is the gayest thread ever

[/ QUOTE ]

thanks, it was clearly the bastard child of yours

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
ace high looks good. you look like you have nothing. he is betting a lot. if he has a pair, he should check and hope to beat your ace high.

[/ QUOTE ]

the answer is A6, the elaboration is alot of villains bluffs beat ace high.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

yeah, pr+fd is possible. I think AK is close, though.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

I thought you play it well actually. If he has queen, you would likely hear from him before river I think. So without blocking river, you do take chance that he has a jack or anything beat you. But given your description, check call is better.

His bet size also looks like a bluff.
Are you folding here if he bet 2/3 pot or way over bet?

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

I'm with you, maybe also QJ. Villian either has nothing at all or Jx. He does not have AJ else he would have raised on the flop.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

Good call with 77. I might have done it with worse.

Think about what your play looks like to the villian. You raised pf, checked the flop, tried to buy it on the turn, and then checked the river. He puts on NOTHING.

Also, the size of his bet is telling. There is no reason for him to bet so large when you clearly have nothing. Even if he has a small pair, I see him checking behind because with a bet sized like his on the river, he is only going to get called if beat, and you aren't going to fold a better hand since HE hasn't shown strength.

You can call with lots of crap here, the only danger is him putting you on a smallish pair, and trying to bet you off with a slightly larger pair.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
Good call with 77. I might have done it with worse.

Think about what your play looks like to the villian. You raised pf, checked the flop, tried to buy it on the turn, and then checked the river. He puts on NOTHING.

Also, the size of his bet is telling. There is no reason for him to bet so large when you clearly have nothing. Even if he has a small pair, I see him checking behind because with a bet sized like his on the river, he is only going to get called if beat, and you aren't going to fold a better hand since HE hasn't shown strength.

You can call with lots of crap here, the only danger is him putting you on a smallish pair, and trying to bet you off with a slightly larger pair.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is precisely why I overbet often with the nuts - keeps people who think like this honest (I am not being a deek, I agree with your logic)

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
this is the gayest thread ever

[/ QUOTE ]

Does that mean it is attracted to other MSNL threads?

Ah well...at least you saved it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well done.

Re: opinion time -- how weak will you call
 

[ QUOTE ]

This is precisely why I overbet often with the nuts - keeps people who think like this honest (I am not being a deek, I agree with your logic)

[/ QUOTE ]

I hear what you're saying.

However, most people will NOT make the call with 77. It's a tough call and takes a good, thinking player to make this call.

However, if you are always betting the pot with the nuts as the villian in this situation, you are usually not going to get called, and are probably betting too much to be called with any consistency.

Of course if you play the nuts this way as the villian, you will NOT be maximizing your profits, having missed your chance to get money in on the flop, turn and river.

I LOVE (and am not exaggerating) when my opponent bets the pot on the river and I call with A high and he turns over quads...after he checked behind on the flop, and turn. My opponent wins 3BB with his quads...I can't help but laugh!