Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

5/10 NL at Rio. I am generally LAG but I had only been playing with these opponents for about 15 minutes when I picked QQ. I had won one pot earlier with AK but didn't show. I folded the rest of my hands preflop.

I was 2 off the button. MP1 is loose, weak. MP3 seems very solid. I put him on TT-AA or, probably, AK. I am next to act. Does anyone else just call here? I figured this would maximize the effect of my position.

Also, what to do on the flop?

10 handed.
MP1: $700
MP3: $900+
Hero: $900

Pre-Flop: MP1 calls, MP3 raises to $60. Hero Calls with Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Folds to MP1, who calls.

Flop ($191): 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. MP1 bets $50. MP3 calls. Hero?

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

Raises to $200.

Clearly, a wa/wb situation. If the former, make him pay to try to catch an A, K or 5.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

I don't see how calling is corect and I can't fold here I would make it $175. I would most likley think you have the best hand. If mp3 Had AA-KK a raise from him would have been his best option and the limper could have a wide range of hands you beat.

Hows my thinking?

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

[ QUOTE ]
Raises to $200.

Clearly, a wa/wb situation. If the former, make him pay to try to catch an A, K or 5.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is very wrong. A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] is just one of many hands either player could have that make this NOT a WA/WB scenario.

Also, if it was a WA/WB scenario, raise is not the right answer either.

D

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

Just calling that small flop bet and waiting to see what happens on the turn is fine.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

you could A.) call, on a safe turn pump it up cause you do have position. B.) how are these guys going to play AJs or a hand like that, personally I would PUMP IT UP, others would "call and wait to improve to make more." I would put MP on AK etc. and the other guy could easily have a set, or middle pair, like 88. Personally I would make it $200 to go on flop and be willing to get it all in. But that's with my style. Also $900 at 5/10 NL is only 90 BB so I have no problem getting it all in on flop. With deeper stacks I call in position and see what turn brings.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

Also, it's live, so people have a LOT harder time laying down JJ TT then they do online, so that weighs into my analysis too.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

Stick it to $200.

You've cold called the flop, effictively trapping him into thinking his (most likely) lesser hand is good. Now is the time to either take this down or find out where exactly everyone is. You don't want to risk letting that draw hit for cheap...especially because his bet kind of feels like a blocking bet...I don't know why, just does. I'm putting him on something like A-K/Q or JJ/10-10. If he's got some spades in that Ax option, I think he's definately sticking around, and, being live, I don't think the other option is folding. This raise does put you in the driver's seat for the hand though.

If check raised later, I'm probably vomitting and then folding.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

[ QUOTE ]
Raises to $200.

Clearly, not at all a wa/wb situation. If the former, make him pay to try to catch an A, K or 5.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's more like it.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

BTW everyone - I posted a hand nearly exactly like this one about 2 months ago - I held QQ, I flat called preflop, flop was nearly identical, other caller lead out, original raiser called etc... and the consensus of nearly everyone - Diablo, RBK etc. was that this was a call. Look it up if you want, I think it was called Unexciting Fold or something.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

Thanks, found it. I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who is willing to cold call the QQ preflop.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...8330&page=

I'll post the rest of the hand soon.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

if mp3 is very solid i make it $120 pf. you save alot when he has aa/kk and make alot when he has TT/JJ

make a $150 raise on the flop. all hands will be clearly defined from that point on.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

Hero actually raised to $225 total. MP1 went all-in for about $425 more. MP3 folded. Pot now about $1215 (including MP1's raise). Hero?

About my raise here on the flop...
I put MP1 on a pocket pair 22-TT, but most likely 77 or 88. I was worried about a set but I thought it more likely he just had an overpair or maybe the flush draw. If he put both MP3 and me on two overcards, his bet makes sense. My hand seemed well-disguised because of my just cold-calling pre-flop, so someone with 77-JJ was likely to play with me.

MP3 I put on JJ or A high flush draw, maybe AA or just AK.

My raise of $175 offers any potential callers almost 3-1 pot odds. Anyone with an A high flush draw has 14 outs (8 spades, 3 aces, 3 fives), about 2.25-1 odds. So maybe just calling and waiting for a safe turn card would have been better.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

[ QUOTE ]
if mp3 is very solid i make it $120 pf. you save alot when he has aa/kk and make alot when he has TT/JJ


[/ QUOTE ]

not sure I agree with this, though I can see it being viable against certain opponents....basically, with position I like flat-calling with QQ because you can usually tell postflop if the guy has AA/KK as opposed TT/JJ - BUT - if he does have TT/JJ you get much more value out of him than if you reraise.....i.e. - if you reraise with QQ and the board comes all unders, many guys'll get away from TT/JJ whereas you'll often be able to get some money out of them when you don't reraise.....

the other thing is that when the opponent has AK/AQ you don't take the lead away from them by reraising....I've many times won two and sometimes three barrels from an unimproved AK when the board came raggedy and he had no idea he was up against queens.....

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

Results: I called the $425 all-in bet. MP1 turned over A5o for a straight, and I lost.

I calledexpecting to see a set, but I've seen people do this with overpairs often enough that I figured I was getting plenty of odds to call this (almost 3-1). I probably should have planned better before I raised in the first place.

Re: Coldcalling QQ preflop
 

you need to reraise here. there are several reasons.
you want to see if he reraises.
you don't want to let others in behind you, you already have 2 opponents, you don't want others to join, and if you do not reraise it becomes more attractive for those still to act.
you want to be last to act.
if he is tricky he might call you flat with AA or KK, and then you need to play some poker. however, if you put in a decent raise, he will often reraise or fold. if you can get an idea of where you are, lose MP1, and buy position if the others still to act fold, then you have accomplished a lot.