Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

about 60 left in $5 rebuy on Pokerroom, 30 pay. ive got 9,000 and blinds 300/600. no reads. how would you have played this one?

EDIT: turn 8 clubs.
utg limps, i raise in utg+1 to 2000 with A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], MP calls, rest fold.

flop: K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I check, caller checks.

turn: K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
I check, caller bets 2000, i call.

river: K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

check,check.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

I think you should have led the flop.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

do not like checking the flop

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

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do not like checking the flop

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I think you should have led the flop.

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Why?

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

I dont like the free card. Chances are you good you are ahead right now and that turn card sucked. Not sure if the turn is the 8 or 9 of clubs since both were giving but it puts a two way straight draw on the board and a backdoor flush. Checking the flop also gives him control of the situation. I would rather be in charge here and not give him oppurtunity to catch up.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

a postflop bet is a must for a made or missed hand. It is a way of gathering information. Since no one without x-ray glasses or some mind reading ability can know what another player is holding, it is imperative that you gather information the only way you can. By betting, raising etc... Observing betting patterns from previous hands as well as taking note of each players image is also a must in gathering information.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

Checking the flop is fine. It encourages action from hands you have beat, none of which have many outs against you. A jack, QQ,TT-88. I would bet the turn, especially with the club hitting, but either way - checking the flop is enough weakness, you're definitely getting called by a pair. Having checked the turn, bet 2K on the river to get value from hands that will check behind, having to call a raise but hating it. The same medium strength hands that are willing to bet the turn will usually check behind on the river.

Betting the turn makes it easier to fold to a push, although I'm not sure I would, depending on the opponent. Point being, value betting the river is now really awkward since you have no choice but to pay off a king. Ideally, you'd like to structure the betting to avoid going broke when he has a K. Tough to do this shallow though, so focus on getting value from weaker hands.

Edited to add: With 6K in the pot and 5K behind on the river, I think pushing the river is best *if* he has you covered by enough that he can comfortably call off 5K on the pot odds with a hand like AJ or QQ or even TT-99. Especially if he's the type to call (although you said no read). If 5K would break him, you need to bet less because there are hands he won't be willing to go broke with, even for a 16K pot. Since you're going broke when has a K, you need to get as much as possible when he doesn't. The full 5K if you can, or, more likely 2K-3K. 2K-3K will sort of function as a blocking bet also, because it will be hard for him to raise without a K, and you take away his ability to push you off the best hand because you're obviously committed to calling. Of course, you still have to call the raise because AJ or QQ can make a value raise just often enough that you're stuck.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

No way I ever check this flop. I lead it. If he calls, I lead the turn too.

If he raises, I probably give him credit for trips and move on.

The last thing you want to do is give Q10 AQ, or some other drawing hand sucking out on you.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

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I dont like the free card. Chances are you good you are ahead right now and that turn card sucked. Not sure if the turn is the 8 or 9 of clubs since both were giving but it puts a two way straight draw on the board and a backdoor flush. Checking the flop also gives him control of the situation. I would rather be in charge here and not give him oppurtunity to catch up.

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A free card is not a problem on this flop. Even if he has QT that's only four outs because an A fills you up. He can't catch two pair. If he has a J or pocket pair you want to give him a chance to think he has you beat. If he he unpaired undercards, you want him to catch one of his six "outs."

You don't have to check the flop. Depending on your image, a check may be viewed as strength. And you don't have to feign weakness every time you have AA on a paired flop. But you should sometimes.

This idea that you have to bet to get information is wrong too. A check is an action too and can elicit a readable response. What does he think it means when you check? What hands will he bet when you check? These are questions with answers.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

I think this is fine. You kept the pot small and you didnt scare off the hands you beat and gave them a chance to put some money in on the turn. I dont like getting too aggressive in this spot because I dont nescesarily want to end up allin with this board.

Any reads on villian? If he capable of bluffing this river? I would have bet 2K on the river as kind of a blocking bet in case villian decides you probably dont have a K or boat because you didnt bet it, and he thinks of bluff-pushing you off the hand. It also serves as a value bet.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

I can understand how you feel it may be better to extract more from a weaker pair, nonetheless, I still feel you need to charge your opponent to see another card when you have a strong but very vunerable hand. Hero would be kicking him self if the free card gave villain a fullhouse or straight.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

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I can understand how you feel it may be better to extract more from a weaker pair, nonetheless, I still feel you need to charge your opponent to see another card when you have a strong but very vunerable hand. Hero would be kicking him self if the free card gave villain a fullhouse or straight.

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This is not a very vulnerable hand.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

How can you say that giving the texture of the board after the turn?

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

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How can you say that giving the texture of the board after the turn?

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We're talking about the flop.

I will say:

Betting 2.5-3K on the turn is probably marginally better than 2K with the draws the turn brought. Both better than checking.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

Well then the main prob with the hand is when he checked the turn as well and flat called the bet.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

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Well then the main prob with the hand is when he checked the turn as well and flat called the bet.

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Agreed, and I don't like a checkraise either. Leading the turn is the best option by a lot. 2500-3000 probably best in terms of extracting value, although stack size/pot size makes it awkward.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

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Checking the flop is fine. It encourages action from hands you have beat, none of which have many outs against you. A jack, QQ,TT-88. I would bet the turn, especially with the club hitting, but either way - checking the flop is enough weakness, you're definitely getting called by a pair. Having checked the turn, bet 2K on the river to get value from hands that will check behind, having to call a raise but hating it. The same medium strength hands that are willing to bet the turn will usually check behind on the river.

Betting the turn makes it easier to fold to a push, although I'm not sure I would, depending on the opponent. Point being, value betting the river is now really awkward since you have no choice but to pay off a king. Ideally, you'd like to structure the betting to avoid going broke when he has a K. Tough to do this shallow though, so focus on getting value from weaker hands.

Edited to add: With 6K in the pot and 5K behind on the river, I think pushing the river is best *if* he has you covered by enough that he can comfortably call off 5K on the pot odds with a hand like AJ or QQ or even TT-99. Especially if he's the type to call (although you said no read). If 5K would break him, you need to bet less because there are hands he won't be willing to go broke with, even for a 16K pot. Since you're going broke when has a K, you need to get as much as possible when he doesn't. The full 5K if you can, or, more likely 2K-3K. 2K-3K will sort of function as a blocking bet also, because it will be hard for him to raise without a K, and you take away his ability to push you off the best hand because you're obviously committed to calling. Of course, you still have to call the raise because AJ or QQ can make a value raise just often enough that you're stuck.

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Too late to edit, but in the last paragraph I clearly have the piot size wrong. The fact that it's 9-10K probably makes a push a little better on the river than the 6K I said, because a worse hand is more likely to call. The blocking bet, calling a raise option can work too, but if he has a lot of chips, there's no hand that calls 2K but folds to 5K.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

Could you explain to me what the blocking bet is.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

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Could you explain to me what the blocking bet is.

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Generally, a blocking bet is an underbet on the river with a medium strength hand that you would feel compelled to call a larger bet with if you checked. It is intended to freeze your opponent when he holds a marginally better hand and also to function as a value bet when he has a marginally worse hand. It works best if the board texture is such that it is hard for your opponent to bluff raise you or to raise with a lot of hands that beat you.

Example: pot is 1000, you have a top pair top kicker and a flush comes on the river. You bet 300 because:

if you check, a hand that is worse than a flush but that beats you (say two pair) would bet more.

Your bet tends to prevent him from raising, because you could have the flush and be inducing a raise, and because you're unlikely to pay him off when he's ahead.

In this hand, the blocking bet is a 2K-3K bet on the river that should freeze him from raising with less than a K; the problem is that you are pot committed anyway because your stack is too small relative to the pot. But it does still function as a value bet and reduces the possibility of him putting you allin on a bluff.

Re: Pokerroom $5 rebuy AA hand
 

OK,

Thanks TV.