Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

The average Total Defense rank of Notre Dame's 11 opponents....67th.

Wow, 67th. That includes Purdue and Stanford who come in respectively at 100th and 106th. That great offense must be Weis. Not the fact that you had a veteran QB with a heck of an O-Line and a heck of a TE.

Look at your schedule:
Pittsburgh
Michigan
Michigan State
Washington
Purdue
USC
BYU
Tennessee
Navy
Syracuse
Stanford

Honestly just think about it? Pitt, Tennessee(at their given state which they didn't care anymore), Washington, BYU, Navy, Syracuse, Stanford???? That's 7 gimme wins. Never really noticed that.

Auburn's is 30th, and they beat three teams that are currently ranked inside the top 20. Thier two losses came to LSU who they should have beat but their kicker went 1/6 and they only lost 17-20, and a loss to GT in the opening game with a undeveloped offense, Iron's got one carry that game and their QB had his first start of his career. Auburns offense is just as leathel as ND plus they have a D to back it up. In my personal opinion I think the match up should be OSU vs. Auburn. These two teams are playing better than ND or Oregon right now and if either OSU or Auburn had to play ND it would result in a loss for ND.
Oh yeah Oregon's average total d rank is 79th, yes I know it's the pac ten style of play but its still weak.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

There are other threads about this. No they don't deserve the invite but they are ND so they will get the invite.

p.s. ND is awesome.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Auburns offense is just as leathel as ND plus they have a D to back it up.

[/ QUOTE ]

spelling is fun
so is thinking

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

Sagarin has their schedule as 20th best in the nation. What's the average offense of all those teams?

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

no.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Look at your schedule:
Pittsburgh
Michigan
Michigan State
Washington
Purdue
USC
BYU
Tennessee
Navy
Syracuse
Stanford


[/ QUOTE ]

Overall, that is easily harder than Auburns schedule. For all you SEC lovers, ND scored more points against Tenn than any other team, so perhaps they do have some offense.

but seriously, why will people not just wait until the bowl games get played to bitch about ND? if ND gets blown out, I'll be the first to admit they shouldnt have been there, but what are you guys going to do if ND actually wins, besides make excuses that the refs or the media fixed it for them? you act as if they are some ivy league team that is automatically going to get blown out by 50 points.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]

but seriously, why will people not just wait until the bowl games get played to bitch about ND?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because it's a matter of money. If ND gets a bid they get ~$14.5M whereas if OSU gets a bid they get some (half I think) and the rest is divided between the conference and the other teams in the conference. Therefore, for folks with vested interested in any team in the conference of Oregon, Ohio State or any other team that is "left out" it is a significant issue.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

but seriously, why will people not just wait until the bowl games get played to bitch about ND?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because it's a matter of money. If ND gets a bid they get ~$14.5M whereas if OSU gets a bid they get some (half I think) and the rest is divided between the conference and the other teams in the conference. Therefore, for folks with vested interested in any team in the conference of Oregon, Ohio State or any other team that is "left out" it is a significant issue.

[/ QUOTE ]

in the recent past, the guarenteed payoffs of having one bcs team every year have pretty much equalled out to ND's huge payouts every once in a while

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

but seriously, why will people not just wait until the bowl games get played to bitch about ND?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because it's a matter of money. If ND gets a bid they get ~$14.5M whereas if OSU gets a bid they get some (half I think) and the rest is divided between the conference and the other teams in the conference. Therefore, for folks with vested interested in any team in the conference of Oregon, Ohio State or any other team that is "left out" it is a significant issue.

[/ QUOTE ]

in 2006, tOSU will have a budget of approximately $3.5 Billion dollars. is ~$7.25 million really worth bitching this much over?

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

but seriously, why will people not just wait until the bowl games get played to bitch about ND?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because it's a matter of money. If ND gets a bid they get ~$14.5M whereas if OSU gets a bid they get some (half I think) and the rest is divided between the conference and the other teams in the conference. Therefore, for folks with vested interested in any team in the conference of Oregon, Ohio State or any other team that is "left out" it is a significant issue.

[/ QUOTE ]

in 2006, tOSU will have a budget of approximately $3.5 Billion dollars. is ~$7.25 million really worth bitching this much over?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure about tOSU, but Michigan's athletic budget is fully self supported from donations, bowl income and ticket sales, and takes nothing from the general fund of the school. In that case, $7.25M would be a huge boon to a program (50% of the total payout sounds high, but I'll assume its right for this argument).

That being said, ND is a shoo-in to get a BCS bid. They are a huge national draw and havent been to a BCS game in several years and will travel well. I would guess that tOSU gets the other one since I doubt Oregon has that much national appeal (plus I'm 99% sure that tOSU is a better team than Oregon).

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

I HATE ND but yes they do deserve it...they were a reggie bush push away from beating USC

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

ND vs. Oregon
USC = USC
Stanford = Stanford
Washington = Washington
Fresno State = Michigan
Arizona State = Michigan State
California = Purdue
Washington State = BYU
Oregon State = Tennessee
Arizona = Pittsburgh
Houston = Navy
Montana = Syracuse

Some of those are off, but all in all, I think it averages out. Notre Dame hasn't played any easier a schedule than Oregon. (tOSU has played one of the hardest schedules in the country, they should get in).

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

Yes.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

I'm going to put in the teams final record, and then the record and ranking of the team before ND played them.

Look at your schedule:

Pittsburgh (5-6) (0-0, #23)
Michigan (7-4) (1-0, #3) BCS: #19
Michigan State (5-6) (2-0, NR)
Washington (2-9) (1-2, NR)
Purdue (5-6) (2-1, #22)
USC (11-0) (5-0, #1) BCS: #1
BYU (6-5) (3-3, NR)
Tennessee (5-6) (3-4, NR)
Navy (6-4) (5-3, NR)
Syracuse (1-10) (1-8, NR)
Stanford (5-6) (5-5, NR)

As you can see, ND made their rise up the polls early by beating highly ranked (at the time) teams, and then held their ranking by barely losing to what looked like a struggling USC team at the time, and beating up on teams like the Cuse. Only 2 teams ND played are currently in the BCS, Michigan and USC.

Is ND at top 15 team? Without a doubt. Should they be in a BCS bowl? I'd say probably not, I think there are definately better teams out there. I'll still be looking forward to an OSU/ND game like the ones we had in the 90s. We stomped your ass then and will likely do it again.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
The average Total Defense rank of Notre Dame's 11 opponents....67th.

Wow, 67th. That includes Purdue and Stanford who come in respectively at 100th and 106th. That great offense must be Weis. Not the fact that you had a veteran QB with a heck of an O-Line and a heck of a TE.

Look at your schedule:
Pittsburgh
Michigan
Michigan State
Washington
Purdue
USC
BYU
Tennessee
Navy
Syracuse
Stanford

Honestly just think about it? Pitt, Tennessee(at their given state which they didn't care anymore), Washington, BYU, Navy, Syracuse, Stanford???? That's 7 gimme wins. Never really noticed that.

Auburn's is 30th, and they beat three teams that are currently ranked inside the top 20. Thier two losses came to LSU who they should have beat but their kicker went 1/6 and they only lost 17-20, and a loss to GT in the opening game with a undeveloped offense, Iron's got one carry that game and their QB had his first start of his career. Auburns offense is just as leathel as ND plus they have a D to back it up. In my personal opinion I think the match up should be OSU vs. Auburn. These two teams are playing better than ND or Oregon right now and if either OSU or Auburn had to play ND it would result in a loss for ND.
Oh yeah Oregon's average total d rank is 79th, yes I know it's the pac ten style of play but its still weak.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes.

The BCS is set up for 2 reasons:

1 - Try to get a national championship game. Assuming USC and Texas both win next weekend, the BCS will successfully accomplish this goal.

2 - Make money for the Bowls. The BCS is not designed to pit the 8 best teams in the country against one another. Its secondary goal is to allow the Bowls to both keep their traditions and to create a good matchup that will make money for the Bowl. This is acccomplished by keeping the teams in their traditional Bowl games whenever possible, and by allowing the Bowls to choose 2 at-large teams who meet certain criteria. ND meets the criteria and will attract a large in-stadium and TV audience, making the Bowl successful. Therefore ND deserves a BCS bid. Simple, end of thread.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

good post.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

Yes. They played one of the greatest college games in recent memory, and, hung with the best team in college football, if Reggie Bush doesn't help Leinart across the goaline, they beat the best team in college football. They are more then deserving, and they will be in the title game next year.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yes. They played one of the greatest college games in recent memory, and, hung with the best team in college football, if Reggie Bush doesn't help Leinart across the goaline, they beat the best team in college football. They are more then deserving, and they will be in the title game next year.

[/ QUOTE ]

Care to bet? I'll lay you 2-1.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

He also has my Wolverines in the top 10, which, even given our hard schedule, is not even near the ballpark of where we belong. So I wouldn't take his rankings all that seriously.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

Michigan lost to a top 5 team in a close game without your best player.
Michigan beat a top 3 team in a close game.
Michigan lost to ND in a close game without your best player.
Michigan lost to an OK Minnesota team.
Michigan lost to an OK Wisconsin team in a close game without your best player.

Sure you had a lot of bad breaks, but why is it so hard to believe this is the 9th best team (in terms of who WOULD win long term), when you were 3rd preseason? His rankings don't account for how WELL you have done, but how well you would do in the future.

I'd be hard pressed to find more than 12 teams I'd figure were 1 point favorites or more against Michigan on a neutral site.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
good post.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, i know. even I make one of those every now and then. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

and ladies, will you quit bitching about michigan in here? christ there is so much thread hijacking that goes on in here...

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

Michigan beat Penn State and played close to both Ohio State and Notre Dame. Very few teams in America could have accomplished that. They beat several good teams and had a very difficult schedule. Thinking they're one of the ten best teams (as far as who would be favored in a neutral-site game) is quite reasonable.

People who make the lines take Sagarin's ratings seriously. You should too.

EDIT: TomCollins made a good post on this topic while I was typing this one. Props to TomCollins. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

Didn't Willingham start 8-0 and take an overrated Notre Dame team to a BCS game where the Beavers of Oregon State beat the living piss out of them?

I expect a repeat if tOSU-ND match-up takes place. My $$$ will be on any line less than seven.

As I've stated before, Michigan without Carr is definitely top 10.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

Willingham did not make it to a BCS bowl game, that was Davie's team in 2000. Willingham's team got blown out in the Gator Bowl by NC State.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Willingham's team got blown out in the Gator Bowl by NC State.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was at that game. It RULED. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

If UCLA or Colorado can't get the Nittany Lions into the Rose Bowl, please, puh-LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZE bowl selection officials, find a way for PSU to play Notre Dame. I'd love to see us kick their butts by about three touchdowns.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
If UCLA or Colorado can't get the Nittany Lions into the Rose Bowl, please, puh-LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZE bowl selection officials, find a way for PSU to play Notre Dame. I'd love to see us kick their butts by about three touchdowns.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd love to see that game, but there's no way it happens without massive backroom deals/payoffs between the Bowls. ND and PSU will be the first and second teams chosen by the Bowls to fill their available slots so they won't be able to meet.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Auburns offense is just as leathel as ND plus they have a D to back it up.

[/ QUOTE ]

spelling is fun
so is thinking

[/ QUOTE ]

Good thing to know your checking my spelling, I type quick and don't go back and read it for mistakes. sorry if this upsets you

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
If UCLA or Colorado can't get the Nittany Lions into the Rose Bowl, please, puh-LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZE bowl selection officials, find a way for PSU to play Notre Dame. I'd love to see us kick their butts by about three touchdowns.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. Though I think it would only be a 17 point margin of victory for Penn State. If the game were in Happy Valley, 27 points.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

Why does everyone think tOSU or Penn State would crush ND? Notre Dame was a reggie bush push away from beating the #1 team in the nation. So for what possible reason can you think that a 5th or 6th ranked team would destroy them? I am thinking it has to be anti-ND bias.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

This is why I really hate the BCS.

I am a ND fan. I know it's like being a Yankee fan. And I hate Yankee fans, so I try not to be one. So I am pretty conflicted by this. Does ND deserve to be in a BCS game? The answer, "It doesn't matter."

I've always had a problem with the no playoff in college football. I had hoped that some constant bitching by writers and fans would get something done. Then I heard an interview with the Big East Chairman. He explained why there would never be a tournament. Simply 2/3 of the schools in a conference would have to vote to move from bowls to a tournament. None of them would. Because every time a team makes a bowl game the whole conference splits the money. So a teams like Baylor, Duke and Vandy get a part of $14.5 millon every year. They don't want a playoff they would never see a dime. Yes, I know the better educated college football fan knows this.

Here is the way I look at it. If a team like Oregon or Auburn is pissed that ND will get a BCS bid before them the first place they have to look is straight in the mirror. If the BCS was created to make the most money then you can't spin around and say that the best team deserves to get in to a BCS game.

Notre Dame makes the most money for the Bowl they are in. Every year they qualify they should get a BCS bid. No matter if the only people they played were Navy, Airforce, Army and BYU.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Good thing to know your checking my spelling

[/ QUOTE ]

"You're."

See, I'm helping too.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

I just can't wait for this game to happen. I don't know how well ND will do, but I doubt they would get blown out like these people are saying.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
I just can't wait for this game to happen. I don't know how well ND will do, but I doubt they would get blown out like these people are saying.

[/ QUOTE ]they could easily win as well. Seems to me the USC game could have gone either way, sort of like the tOSU/UT game.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why does everyone think tOSU or Penn State would crush ND? Notre Dame was a reggie bush push away from beating the #1 team in the nation. So for what possible reason can you think that a 5th or 6th ranked team would destroy them? I am thinking it has to be anti-ND bias.

[/ QUOTE ]

Penn State and OSU were both able to beat MSU... easily. I don't think either team is a 2 TD favorite over ND. A 5-7 point range is appropriate.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why does everyone think tOSU or Penn State would crush ND? Notre Dame was a reggie bush push away from beating the #1 team in the nation. So for what possible reason can you think that a 5th or 6th ranked team would destroy them? I am thinking it has to be anti-ND bias.

[/ QUOTE ]

see my post about 20 posts back.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Penn State and OSU were both able to beat MSU... easily. I don't think either team is a 2 TD favorite over ND. A 5-7 point range is appropriate.

[/ QUOTE ]
The MSU team that beat ND in OT was a completely different team than the one who played the second half against OSU or played Penn State. MSU turned from Jekyle to Hyde on that blocked field goal and went from a very good team. To a very average team. Not the first time it has happened to the Spartans.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
Notre Dame was a reggie bush push away from beating the #1 team in the nation.

[/ QUOTE ]

there wasn't anybody to tackle him, he backs in with or without Bush's help

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why does everyone think tOSU or Penn State would crush ND? Notre Dame was a reggie bush push away from beating the #1 team in the nation. So for what possible reason can you think that a 5th or 6th ranked team would destroy them? I am thinking it has to be anti-ND bias.

[/ QUOTE ]

Penn State and OSU were both able to beat MSU... easily. I don't think either team is a 2 TD favorite over ND. A 5-7 point range is appropriate.

[/ QUOTE ]

OSU was losing with five minutes to go, and got a gift on special teams at the end of the half which led to a 10 point swing and a complete turn of momentum. I fail to see how this can in any way, shape, or form be described as an easy win. Penn State, on the other hand, got out to a quick 17-0 lead and led the whole way, so at least you got one right.

Re: Is ND really deserving for BCS
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why does everyone think tOSU or Penn State would crush ND? Notre Dame was a reggie bush push away from beating the #1 team in the nation. So for what possible reason can you think that a 5th or 6th ranked team would destroy them? I am thinking it has to be anti-ND bias.

[/ QUOTE ]

Penn State and OSU were both able to beat MSU... easily. I don't think either team is a 2 TD favorite over ND. A 5-7 point range is appropriate.

[/ QUOTE ]

OSU was losing with five minutes to go, and got a gift on special teams at the end of the half which led to a 10 point swing and a complete turn of momentum. I fail to see how this can in any way, shape, or form be described as an easy win. Penn State, on the other hand, got out to a quick 17-0 lead and led the whole way, so at least you got one right.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exhibit B: Stanford. Do I need to say more?