Two Plus Two Older Archives - QQ

Two Plus Two Older Archives (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/index.php)

- Small Stakes Shorthanded (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=20)

- - QQ - Folding the flop (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=385762)

POKhER

11-26-2005 07:12 PM

QQ - Folding the flop

I have QQ, Guy raises and i 3bet he calls.

*** FLOP ***
K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($4.25)
He bets, Can i really call ?

I folded, Agree its ok? (Unknown by the way)

milesdyson

11-26-2005 07:14 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

yes, fold.

POKhER

11-26-2005 07:18 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

Lol, just wondering if we have any callers... Or peelers in the house.

Sightless

11-26-2005 07:21 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

Seems like a fold to me

imported_leader

11-26-2005 07:31 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

Yeah it's not worth it.

milesdyson

11-26-2005 07:40 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

while we're on big pairs folding the flop - how's this?

i really don't know these guys. neither have been at the table long at all.

Absolute Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG caps, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (12.5 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, UTG caps, i fold at what will be 22.5:2.

POKhER

11-26-2005 07:52 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

Hmm tough one miles, I honestly don't know if i find the fold button there because im on a angry "I just lost $10 in 3minutes" mood [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img](And not playing).

Any reads on UTG/others?

On a side note, How you get converter to work ?!?!?

cfjr2

11-26-2005 10:20 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

you need a K (2 outs) followed by any board card (10 outs)
2/47 * 10 / 46 = ~1%

your ~77 bets short here

Alobar

11-26-2005 10:31 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

[ QUOTE ]
you need a K (2 outs) followed by any board card (10 outs)
2/47 * 10 / 46 = ~1%

your ~77 bets short here

[/ QUOTE ]

or maybe u are still ahead

cfjr2

11-26-2005 10:35 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

against a slow played flop like this? how often

Wynton

11-26-2005 10:40 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

If you were in villain's spot with pocket Js or worse, wouldn't you occasionally be tempted to try to win the pot by firing a bet on the flop?

This is a hard spot against an unknown, and you're probably behind. But I think you should recognize that it is possible you're actually ahead in the hand.

Alobar

11-26-2005 10:43 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

[ QUOTE ]
against a slow played flop like this? how often

[/ QUOTE ]

not sure what you mean by slow played flop. But there are plenty of situations where you still have the best hand. BB has TT or T9 and the other guy has QQ or JJ or AKh and the other guy as 98 (youve got outs against) and stuff. Not saying the fold is good or bad, but to assume you are behind to the point of needing a FH to win is a bit much I think.

milesdyson

11-26-2005 10:46 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
against a slow played flop like this? how often

[/ QUOTE ]

not sure what you mean by slow played flop. But there are plenty of situations where you still have the best hand. BB has TT or T9 and the other guy has QQ or JJ or AKh and the other guy as 98 (youve got outs against) and stuff. Not saying the fold is good or bad, but to assume you are behind to the point of needing a FH to win is a bit much I think.

[/ QUOTE ]
yeah that flop was not exactly slowplayed. i would have called here with the K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

cfjr2

11-26-2005 10:53 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

what i meant by slow played flop is MP called the bet then re-raised a raise. to me this means he knew he was going to get his action on the flop and decided to not wait to pop the turn with his 2p (or set)

imported_leader

11-26-2005 11:00 PM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

[ QUOTE ]
while we're on big pairs folding the flop - how's this?

i really don't know these guys. neither have been at the table long at all.

Absolute Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG caps, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (12.5 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, UTG caps, i fold at what will be 22.5:2.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not folding that.

xLukex

11-27-2005 02:02 AM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
while we're on big pairs folding the flop - how's this?

i really don't know these guys. neither have been at the table long at all.

Absolute Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG caps, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (12.5 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, UTG caps, i fold at what will be 22.5:2.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not folding that.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno, BB check-raising probably means JT. Not sure what UTG has here, but it could be aces, could be AK [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

I'm not saying I particularly love this fold, but it's definitely not bad.

Spicymoose

11-27-2005 02:16 AM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
while we're on big pairs folding the flop - how's this?

i really don't know these guys. neither have been at the table long at all.

Absolute Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG caps, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (12.5 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, UTG caps, i fold at what will be 22.5:2.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not folding that.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno, BB check-raising probably means JT. Not sure what UTG has here, but it could be aces, could be AK [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

I'm not saying I particularly love this fold, but it's definitely not bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the fold is bad. It could be one of the hands you mentioned, but it could also be A9s, TT, JJ, QQ, Ah7h, AhTh, AhJh, AhQh.

imported_leader

11-27-2005 03:07 AM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
while we're on big pairs folding the flop - how's this?

i really don't know these guys. neither have been at the table long at all.

Absolute Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG caps, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (12.5 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, UTG caps, i fold at what will be 22.5:2.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not folding that.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno, BB check-raising probably means JT. Not sure what UTG has here, but it could be aces, could be AK [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

I'm not saying I particularly love this fold, but it's definitely not bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you're OOP here, I could see a fold. However, you get to see the action before it gets to you on the turn. BB could easily have a 9 here and UTG could be capping QQ-TT.

milesdyson

11-27-2005 04:24 AM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

nah, bb doesn't easily have a 9 here. it's actually really rare that he has just a single pair (QQ/JJ/TT are really the most likely pair hands for him). most likely he has JT/99/88/77 or two pair. in this hand the turn was a Q and the river a K. he showed 65. the capper had JJ. i wasn't nearly as worried about the capper as i was the 3-bettor - he just made my odds worse to continue.

imported_leader

11-27-2005 05:29 AM

Re: QQ - Folding the flop

[ QUOTE ]
he showed 65.

[/ QUOTE ]

OR he could be a total donk. As indicated by CC in the BB. I think he could easily have A9,K9,Q9,J9,T9 here. Those are frequent CC hands for donks.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:21 PM.