Royal LHE on Ub
 

Any of you guys played the Royal version of LHE? I have been playing the play money version for now till I get a better strategy of the game before playing for real. It's not very popular in real money yet and can only be short handed play for obvious reasons. Any thoughts?

Thanks

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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Any of you guys played the Royal version of LHE? I have been playing the play money version for now till I get a better strategy of the game before playing for real. It's not very popular in real money yet and can only be short handed play for obvious reasons. Any thoughts?

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I figure new games are always better for smart players, so like TD at UB, these should be massively profitable in BB/100 even if they may have trouble spreading medium limits.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

I'm assuming this is the game played with a stripped deck. I'm almost positive someone already did the odds for a lot of common situtions, but I can't find the post (Gritter or Fnord maybe?).

If I remember right, straights and flushes are the hands you want to avoid. Two pair and trips fill up a ridiculious amount of the time.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

Are they actually spreading it for real money now? Dear god, they are.

I think most of us played it when they were only spreading it NL, but the strategy has to be about the same: anything less than an overfull is crap. It's always nice to have top set early, especially against people who don't realize their nut straights are drawing dead.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

I agree that this game should be hugely profitable.

For the average fish coming over from Texas, EVERY starting hand looks playable. They will also tend to underestimate the hand strength needed to win each pot.

I don't think it can be wrong to stick to AA and KK, adding AK when you think you can get in cheaply. Be very conservative postflop without a set or top two pair.

Remember to consider your overall equity, not just where you are at the moment. With so few cards in the deck, each street can make a massive difference in your standing.

Never fold a set of aces, and please don't play in my games.

I'll add more comments as I play this game more often.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

If you feel qualified to estimate, how many BB/hour could a good player beat NL Royal HE for?

Edit: I just noticed they aren't spreading real money NL. Make it a theoretical question then.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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If you feel qualified to estimate, how many BB/hour could a good player beat NL Royal HE for?

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Once it went over 100, I stopped counting. Every time you flop a set and somebody else flops a straight, you get all their chips.

Eventually there would have to be some level of wising up to the game, but even then I think it would be substantially better than regular NL.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

Yeah the deck is only made up of A,K,Q,J and T's or 20 cards hence the 6 max play. Flushes are only going to be Royal Flushes so suited cards are not worth much since it's still hard to get a Royal.

Flopping a straight is almost always a sucker bet. When a straight hits the board is the only time your good but so is everyone else. AA, KK and even QQ is pretty good pre flop if you hit trips since you will have a good chance of filling up by the river. Top 2 pair isn't bad but harder to fill up. Depending on the situation really anything less than a straight on the board is bad. Going to do some figuring with Poker Stove on this. Would like to get a starting hand chart, odds, implied odds, betting strategy, etc.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

I tried this game today for the first time on UB. I was too chicken to invest too much money, so I played .02/.04. I played for about 15-20 minutes and ended up around $2, so about 50 big bets. I believe this game can be highly profitable. So many people refusing to believe their two pair are beat along with people calling with the bad end of a boat. Personally, i did not raise one time preflop, even with AA. The games are of course very wild. It will be interesting to see if this game can become popular enough to spread to the 2/4, 3/6 and higher limits.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

I emailed Ub about that and they don't know yet. This is what they told me;

Yes. It is possible that we can post some of these tables in the future but we can't confirm you this yet.
Please feel free to contact us in case you have further questions or need more assistance. It is a pleasure to help you!

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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If you feel qualified to estimate, how many BB/hour could a good player beat NL Royal HE for?

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Once it went over 100, I stopped counting. Every time you flop a set and somebody else flops a straight, you get all their chips.

Eventually there would have to be some level of wising up to the game, but even then I think it would be substantially better than regular NL.

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Honestly, I think this game would be awful at 3/6 or higher after the first week or so. The strategy is incredibly simple. There just wouldn't be a whole lot seperating anyone.

It's only good at the lower limits because people aren't thinking about the game what so ever. This game makes euchre look like bridge.

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I don't think it can be wrong to stick to AA and KK, adding AK when you think you can get in cheaply. Be very conservative postflop without a set or top two pair.


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I think you're too tight. AK rules! It's still got 65% equity vs. a random hand (admittedly much less than AA and KK, but still a 2:1 favorite.) If the donks are going to play AT or random crap in the blinds, it would be a crying shame not to raise AK.

I play AK 100% of the time and raise to enter, or raise vs. a limper. You are looking to make top two pair or trips. If you're up against AA or KK this is much less likely so you can usually leave the hand cheaply. Overall you are only a 2:1 dog vs. QQ+ (when the relative probabilities of the hands are included), so even against a tight opponent your folding equity makes this a hand to raise.

Admittedly I just finished digging myself out of my initial fishy hole, so take this with a grain of salt. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

You are dead on my friend. In the end it's all about the full house, period! When the board pairs and you don't have a piece of the house then you must fold.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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flushes are the hands you want to avoid.

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A flush will never lose in this game.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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flushes are the hands you want to avoid.

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A flush will almost always lose in this game.

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Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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flushes are the hands you want to avoid.

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A flush will almost always lose in this game.

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The flush is always royal, and therefore always wins.

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D'oh! You're right. [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

I've found even more players coming in to the game (.25/.50 and .5/1) and not knowing the game rules than even in TD. In TD you'll only occasionally get the "why didn't I win, I had trips!" type of people. In Royal you will routinely get people who go a few orbits before complaining about how the sight is rigged and giving out too many good hands as they continue to see their low two pairs and straights lose.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

This game is great. Definite advantage for people who understand fundamental game theory.

I can finally justify folding pocket jacks to a raise. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

I was just at a table where the board was a royal. And the villian bet on the river...

"What are you betting for"
"I don't know - I had a royal!"

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The thing that amazes me about this game is how much goes up in rake. Especially as idiots keep raising on boeard straights with no flushes possible. The bad player is saved a lot of money since split pots happen a lot (board straights plus same full houses).

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No chit, it does makes sense to bet one time but not raise and cap it just because. There was 4 of a kind on the board with an ace kicker with no royal possible and one guy did fold.

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Raise the river when the board makes a straight. I've had plenty of people fold to it.

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Never played it. I don't know if UB uses burn cards. I know Stars does not. If no burn cards, then at most you could play 7 handed (14 cards out + 5 on the board). If burn cards are used, then 6 handed is the max. I assume you can play one or none from your hand (ie that the game is Holdem).

Once all the cards are out, one and 2 pair hands are meaningless. 2 pair only has value as a draw.

Clearly, flushes impossible to get. Only royal straight flushes are available in the game. Even if you flop a "4 flush", you only have 1 out in 15 unseen cards. Drawing to the royal would usually be a sucker bet. Thus, playing a suited hand is usually wrong.

By the same token, if there is a 3 flush on the board by the river, there is only 1 possible hand out that can be a royal. In a 7 handed game, if you don't have any of the suit, there is a 1/66 chance that someone was dealt the royal.

With a 4 flush on the board, it is nealy 100% that someone was dealt a royal. Whether they are still in the hand is another question.

If the board doesn't pair, everyone will have a straight.
If the board pairs once, there will likely be multiple straights out with the significant chance of losing to a boat. If the board pairs twice, then there probably is only one straight out, but boats and quads rule. And all straights can do is tie. If all you have is a straight, you don't have much. Flopped straights have terrible reverse implied odds. Thus, playing an unpaired hand is usually wrong.

So that leaves you with playing pocket pairs. There are 20*19/2 or 190 starting hands. 30 of them are pocket pairs. So, you have a much better chance of getting one than a 52 card deck (78/1326).

Note: in a 7 handed game, if you have a pocket pair, then there is usually 1 more pocket pair out on average. (25 pocket pairs left in (19*18/2=) 153 possible starting hands left * 6 remaining players). So being dealt TT is not a cause for celebration.

Once you get a pocket pair, you have a much better (23%) chance to flop a set than a regular game, and a 6% chance to flop a boat. Once you flop a set, you have 7 outs in 15 unseen cards to boat or better on the turn, then 10 outs in 14 unseen cards to boat or better the river. With that pot equity, you should be ramming and jamming your sets.

So, the name of the game is boats (and quads). Boat over boat will be common, so JJ and especially TT should be leary.

Just my 2 cents.

PS If you can get in cheaply, AK has a 13% chance to flop top 2 pair. If it does do, it has a 48% chance with 2 to come hit a 4 outer and boat up, and a 29% chance on the river unless it is facing AA or KK, which is rare but happens.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

I have yet to see anyone fold in this case. And I have seen lots of people make the -$ raise.

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Man, you guys take this game way too seriously. I just jack it up pre-flop and on the flop and hope I end up w/ a full house.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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It will be interesting to see if this game can become popular enough to spread to the 2/4, 3/6 and higher limits.

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They've got it at 2/4 and 3/6 now, although at the moment no one's playing 3/6.

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There's two full 2/4 and 3 3/6 games going right now. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

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oh my god these games are so good. i am raping the 1/2 games like it's play money.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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oh my god these games are so good. i am raping the 1/2 games like it's play money.

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Clayton speaks the truth. I have never seen a game where donks and fish lose more.

Over 3 days I have turned 150 to 850 just playing royal hold'em. The Theory of Poker knowledge is a huge advantage here. The game is all about understanding odds and postflop play.

And additionally the game is fun! There is always an interesting board and wonderful hands. I have had about 5 royal flushes and numerous quads. You must always understand what the nuts are and have a good idea of what your opponents knowledge level is. Have fun!

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

If UB are on their toes, they could corner the market for this game and bring in SnG's, MTTs, you name it.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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I play AK 100% of the time and raise to enter, or raise vs. a limper.

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Any thoughts on raising other hands? Obviously at a wild table you don't have to worry about telegraphing strength, but I've been at some tighter tables where a preflop raise tends to kill action on later streets if the board looks favorable for AA/KK. On the other hand, there's nothing more annoying than letting someone limp in with JT or TT and hit quads or a royal.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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oh my god these games are so good. i am raping the 1/2 games like it's play money.

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Clayton speaks the truth. I have never seen a game where donks and fish lose more.

Over 3 days I have turned 150 to 850 just playing royal hold'em. The Theory of Poker knowledge is a huge advantage here. The game is all about understanding odds and postflop play.

And additionally the game is fun! There is always an interesting board and wonderful hands. I have had about 5 royal flushes and numerous quads. You must always understand what the nuts are and have a good idea of what your opponents knowledge level is. Have fun!

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I agree, I started with $100 at the 1/2 tables before Ub raised the stakes and turned it into $1000 in just a week. I did experience a couple 30-40BB losses but that was after I quicky made some cash. This was when the game was brand new so it won't be this easy anymore as I have noticed the skill level of the players have gone up. Overall it takes less skill than the regular game so in time it will probably be to hard to make money.

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I kept $300 at UB just so I could play this game. And I really suck at limit. It's just too easy. QQ, KK, AA, AK.

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Am I the only one who finds this game really hard to play shorthanded? I have been crushing 6 and 5 handed games by sitting back and waiting for big pairs->big boats. Once it gets down to 3-handed or less, I get destroyed. The normally awful, fishy way to play becomes really hard to beat. I feel like the fish are running over me, autoraising the button on my BB, etc. WTF?

Since a tight strategy is the only way to play this, how should I adjust to playing HU and 3 handed? just sit out?

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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Am I the only one who finds this game really hard to play shorthanded?

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I just call a lot. It's painful from a TAG perspective, but it's worked pretty well for me.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

I've been wondering if maybe it is a bad idea to raise pre-flop and instead, always just limp in Royal Holdem.

This game is all about post-flop decisions. Due to the striped deck, post flop draws are pretty strong and suckouts happen frequently. So, should you just limp in order to make villains post flop decsions more incorrect?

Also, while a premium pre-flop hand like AA is really strong pre-flop, its equity on the flop can quickly go down the crapper if you don't flop a set. This feels very similar to the 'forgoe the raise until the turn with TT' situation in SSHE since our equity will change drastically on the next street.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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Am I the only one who finds this game really hard to play shorthanded?

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I prefer playing this game HU. Knowing where you are is much easier and it's more fun because you can play a lot more hands. Keep in mind that hands such as trips and straight increase in value (although I will still chuck a straight on the flop against an aggressive opponent).

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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Am I the only one who finds this game really hard to play shorthanded?

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I prefer playing this game HU. Knowing where you are is much easier and it's more fun because you can play a lot more hands. Keep in mind that hands such as trips and straight increase in value (although I will still chuck a straight on the flop against an aggressive opponent).

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Straights are worthless.

Re: Royal LHE on Ub
 

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I've been wondering if maybe it is a bad idea to raise pre-flop and instead, always just limp in Royal Holdem.

This game is all about post-flop decisions. Due to the striped deck, post flop draws are pretty strong and suckouts happen frequently. So, should you just limp in order to make villains post flop decsions more incorrect?

Also, while a premium pre-flop hand like AA is really strong pre-flop, its equity on the flop can quickly go down the crapper if you don't flop a set. This feels very similar to the 'forgoe the raise until the turn with TT' situation in SSHE since our equity will change drastically on the next street.

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Anyone?